Raymond: "....and any non-folk song for JJ Flash, and what would be your response?" JC: How long have you got. If it was our club where it happened the singer would not be asked to sing again - that's all. Me; That includes Walter Pardon, then? JC: I have never seen a singer stopped on stage in the middle of a song and asked to desist. As I said, we ran resident-based clubs, not singarounds. What we often got was singers turning up, asking the doorkeeper for a floorspot, then pissing off down to the bar without finding out what kind of a club we were - they were usually looking for bookings. We operated a policy club, and felt it our responsibility to honour that policy because that's what we drew our audience in for. Me; Thanks for the detailed account of your club-running days, but I was actually proposing a sort of thought experiment: Imagine you were running a club that booked Walter Pardon. Would you have taken care to discourage him in advance against singing anything you didn't consider to be a folk song, or rebuked him afterwards if he had? "To put it another way, would you have vetted a traditional singer's repertoire in advance before you let him/her sing at your club" JC: If we were booking a singer we would want to know what he/she did beforhand - doesn't everybody - is that what you mean by vetting? Me: Not quite. More than just a general notion of what a singer does ("Oh, Walter Pardon – sings songs learned orally from his community, unaccompanied and plays a bit of melodeon"). Would you actually make a point of confirming in advance with a booked guest that he/she would under no circumstances sing a song that didn't conform in every angle and contour with the 1954 definition? Now that's what I call vetting. "And would your audience have trashed the room in righteous fury if Walter had sung, say, Underneath The Arches". JC: The Singer's Club audience would not have been happy bunnies - they were an extremely discriminating mob. During the thirty years of its existence it built up a reputaition for traditional and traditional based songs well sung - how would you feel if you had flown halfway round the world to hear great ballad singing only to be given - what was it.....? Me: Unhappy bunnies taking themselves far too seriously, by the sound of it. Did the Singer's Club really bus its audience in from the other side of the world? JC: I'm afraid you're pissing against the wind with Walter. He had a large repertoire of music hall, Victorian parlour ballads and early 20th century pop songs which he pointedly refused to sing in public, not just our club - and was extermely reluctant to record, despite our efforts (but we got them in the end, nice man that he was). He had an almost photographic memory when it came to picking up songs and sucked them up like a vaccuum cleaner - he compartmentalised them and analysed them at great length - some transcripts available on request. Me: Can you offer an opinion on why he took the trouble to learn these songs around which he placed this cordon sanitaire? And do you think his reluctance to inflict them on "discriminating" folk audiences (and collectors) had anything to do with what he thought they'd put up with? JC: I suggest you get out of this minefield while you still have your feet. Me: I assume that's the line you used with singers who didn't sing the sort of songs you liked. Okay, mate – I can take a hint. Cheerio! Nice to talk...
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