You see, this is my point regarding evidence etc. Dates of census etc are of historic record yet still clerics insist history is wrong if it contradicts Scripture.

If religions wish to have a place in society beyond those drawn into the hardcore stuff, they have to accept that most rational people, including most who profess their faith, draw a line at trying to marry up facts with traditional stories.

It takes more than wittering on about the little baby Jesus. In the meantime, we see the rise of faith in educated societies. Scrutiny should be enough to find the appropriate level of engagement but whilst they wish children to actually believe myth as fact, we hang our collective head in shame.