I had other stuff to do today, but spent the morning listening to a couple of the podcasts of the Freakonomics radio show. I've wanted to know about the agency that was in existence that Musk supposedly took over (and I think all of the original staff resigned shortly thereafter because of what he was doing to break things.)

Yesterday I heard enough of the program to make a couple of notes so I could find the whole thing today. Stephen Dubner interviewed several people in a two-episode program about "Sludge," the term used now to describe administrative red tape.

Sludge, part 1 is interesting, and worth a listen.

Sludge, part 2 is where he interviews Jennifer Pahlka.

It’s probably not surprising that many of the personal sludge stories we received had to do with government sludge. And when you think about government sludge at this moment in time, you may well think of Elon Musk, the world’s wealthiest man and one of its most unusual. He has been deputized by Donald Trump to drain the D.C. swamp, to take a chainsaw to bureaucracy — pick your metaphor, there are plenty to go around. Musk runs a new entity called DOGE, the Department of Government Efficiency, which took over and renamed an existing entity called the U.S.D.S., or U.S. Digital Service. So we thought it’d be good to speak with one of the people who founded the U.S.D.S., a little over 10 years ago, under President Obama.

PAHLKA: I’m Jennifer Pahlka. I wrote a book called Recoding America: Why Government is Failing in the Digital Age and How We Can Do Better.

Pahlka no longer works in government, but she’s usually adjacent.

PAHLKA: I work with governments — state, federal, and local — to increase their capacity, to achieve their policy goals. I founded a nonprofit that helps state and local governments do all that stuff.

That nonprofit is called Code for America. Pahlka does some other things as well.

PAHLKA: I served on the Defense Innovation Board, trying to help the Defense Department be better. I do stuff like that. I write a lot. I write a Substack called Eating Policy.

It was in 2014 that Pahlka co-founded the U.S. Digital Service. It was imagined as a kind of anti-sludge strike force, going from agency to agency to help them update their digital infrastructure. And how did Jennifer Pahlka become this kind of a fixer? I asked her; specifically, I asked what sort of superpower this requires.

I'll leave it to everyone to go listen to the program (or read the transcript - the part you see here is cut and paste from there). This program was recorded many weeks ago, before Musk had done as much damage as now. At about 42:10 into the program he asks her how she would have have approached what Musk has been tasked with now. The difference between how she might do it and Musk is doing it is that she knows what she's doing but wouldn't do it this way.