thank you!, and it's just that I was curious, I'll probably never get around to doing it. It wasnt that I had a drive to make one it's just that, I found it so frustrating that I couldn't work out HOW. I was nervous that, in the unlikely event I would make one, I would be unable to and spin around after a frustrated and frenzied,whirling dervish fashion and probably end up taking off or, drilling through the floor Imagine that!, how would I explain it? so I thought its safer to get this mystery solved right now, thanks Agathas. (I tried turning sideways and I still couldn't see my profile, just my nose, but I could see that when I was looking the other way too. paper on wall seems like a good idea but cows do not have bits of paper just lying about the stall, cows cannot easily pick up drawing tools, cows do not know how to communicate to friend-cows such complicated instructions in anytime less than 2 years of mooing)   moocowpoo