Wow, I'm having a hard time believing LBJ doesn't rate much lower than most of you have him.

- He earned the nickname "Landslide Lyndon" over election fraud early in his career.

- He violated the civil liberties of at least his enemies and friends, conducting illegal survellence and wiretaps to build up materials in case he need to use them. He was the called the best arm twister in Senate history because he had a lot ong people to work with. According to legend LBJ was the only president to have a better dossier on J. Edgar Hoover than Hoover had on him and he was the one who set up the taping of the Oval Office (producing, for example, the Nixon tapes).

- He may have had plausible deniablility, but the Gulf of Tonkin incident and the real slaughter in Viet Nam rest squarely on his shoulders no matter who sent advisors before him or who got stuck with the war after him.

- All that and we haven't even gotten to the documentary the History Channel was showing implicating him in Kennedy's assassination.

We are talking about US presidents aren't we?