Well, I said it was shorthand. The "fallacy" comes only from the compression.   If we are going to talk about whether there IS anything other than matter and mechanism in existence, all I can offer is good wishes, in the final analysis. I am at a loss to offer any other model which takes knowing anything in to account. You may feel that if you just add enough complexity to a material system, self awareness and knowing will arise like some Frankenstinan sequela, but I believe that is an absolute cop-out. My own out of body experiences, and those described by many others, indicate to me that there is no question that something more than electrons underlies the simple phenomenon of you, Bill, looking at a picture from a past experience and understanding it, or reading what I write here and understanding that.

But, I have to add in all fairness that identities are like those little wooden dolls that used to be made in China, Russia and Jaspan wher eone nests within another within another.

The boundaries and mechasnisms which define how one shrinks down from one level of identity to another are not fully known, for sure. But I think the general pattern is a good analogy.

It is perfectly possible to have an identity which sees anything beyond the solid as delusion. That keeps things stable and predictable, largely. The reasons for doing so could be many. And from that point of view, of course, any suggestion that there is an alternative would look foppish, or delusory, or threatening, or fraudulent, or stupid depending on the individual turns.

In the final analysis, we may p'raps have to just agree to disagree, and offer the warmest of good wishes.

Dang, some one is asking me to do something productive...

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