A friend of his introduces Alberto to a Shaman, then the friends bet one another $100 that the Shaman can not negatively influence Alberto's Health

Well, obviously Alberto knew of the "curse" beforehand, then.

Sounds to me like he didn't need either fear or desire to be affected by the Shaman's workings either. He (quite logically and consciously) invited the experience when he made the bet! So of course he was affected.

And I bet he was right asking about those subconscious fears, too. Inviting an unknown and potentially dangerous situation upon oneself is bound to make anyone a bit nervous -- I don't care how "scientific" they are.

I have some personal experience dealing with "black magick" myself, as you know. I was a pretty sick, sorry and messed-up puppy until I reached a greater understanding of what was affecting me and how, consciously changed my fearful, angry thought patterns and released all that negative emotion. That was a difficult piece of work and it did take some time, but it was worth it! Because today there's no way something like that could have any effect on me whatsoever - except perhaps making me stronger by giving my defenses a good workout.

There are other ways a human being can be breached.

OK I'm curious - how? Through trickery - ie assuming the form of a family member or someone else the person trusts during a dream, then attacking while their defenses are down? Or just plain "rushing" and overpowering the victim during a dream - ie an unprovoked surprise attack from behind? Unfortunately I have some experience with both those scenarios as well.

Gotta love getting into magick and shamanism, with the "wrong people" - NOT!

I do apologize to all for the thread drift but I am curious about this. Maybe you could respond to me privately Two Bears?

daylia