Thank you, Peter K for taking the time to spell this out. It was a well-illustrated observation, and probably took a while to compose. I for one don't intend to dismiss it out of hand.

BB, substantive dialog doesn't come with the simple ability to write sentences. Moving subject and object and the connecting and modifying bits around on the page, regardless of what they really mean ("judge the form, not the content" said beardedbruce regarding his sonnets) is to place the grammar, the structure, above the content and the context. As a favorite English professor of mine pointed out in a difficult history of language class, "grammer is just manners." People without proper understanding of the rules of grammar (whatever language they speak) can make themselves understood even if they don't follow the grammatical conventions. Language came first, the rules came later (about the time of the printing press).

While we place importance on word order and subject and object and verb agreement, we'd be complete fools if we ignored any dialog that doesn't exactly conform to those rules. Yet the parallel exists here. Beardedbruce, who has been around for a year or more but only started posting voraciously when Blackcatter started that ill-conceived best poet thread, has loosed his mighty pen here at Mudcat and is dismayed that we are underwhelmed by his facile ability with words. That's because many of read beyond face-value and expect deeper understanding of our posts in return.

We've seen a lot of growth and understanding of issues occur here at Mudcat over time. It's an open forum. Many make solid contributions from wherever their political position, some never quite get it, others are rough gems with a spark of real insight and humanity that peeks through on occasion. We come from polar extremes on some of our political views. Beardedbruce, I hope you'll calm down and do some reading before you make any more pronouncements about the political ideals and impulses of the members here and consider it if is fair or even necessary that they meet your particular standards. If they aren't performing in the way you want them to on your thread, maybe it's because there is something wrong with the thread (or the person who hovers over it) instead of the wide variety of Mudcatters who have taken time to post here.

To be fair, we've all been trounced at one time or another here at the Mudcat, and this is your turn. You'll get over it and discussion will calm down (or you'll go away and pout and say nasty things about Mudcat--it's your choice).

SRS