"The Great Law of the Six Nations Iroquois Confederacy contained this advice: 'In our every deliberation, we must consider the impact of our decision on the next seven generations.' We are stewards; we are caretakers. That standard will keep us great."

I think it was CarolC in that particular thread who said that this principle was extended to include the impact on every living creature for the next seven generations.

When you put the two together, my point was that if you did consider the impact of your every action over the course of seven generations, the overwhelming instinct would be to keep things a near as possible to what they are - sort of acts as a disincentive to progress.

I don't agree with this interpretation of my words or of the Seven Generations philosophy at all. In the first place, the operative word is "impact". This doesn't mean that one should never do anything that might cause any harm to any living creature, ever. But it does mean that since all of nature is a very complicated and interconnected web, it isn't possible for us to do things that disrupt that web without causing some kind of disruption of our own way of life.

So in order to be able to keep this planet, which is a closed system, viable for supporting human life, we need to consider whether or not our actions support that system, or undermine that system, in the long run (seven generations).

And that is where my suggestion that hubris is a big part of "western stupidity" comes in. To think that we can do anything we want to a system as complicated and interconnected as this one is, without suffering any consequences in the long run, is, in my opinion, the height of hubris. Damn the icebergs, full speed ahead!!! ( ...says the Captain of the Titanic)