The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #79863   Message #1450901
Posted By: GUEST
03-Apr-05 - 01:32 PM
Thread Name: Obit: Pope John Paul II
Subject: RE: Obit: Pope John Paul II
No, the Orthodox Catholics AREN'T part of the Roman Catholic church! That's what the 11th century Schism was all about. They DON'T recognize the pope. The old mode of Orthodox church government was the Patriarchate (remember, they left in a huff and went to Constantinople!). Nowadays, the Patriarchate has much less governmental authority over Orthodox Catholics, because of church governance reforms that the Roman Catholic church would have been wise to incorporate too.

Nowadays, for the most part, the Eastern Orthodox Catholic form of church governance is decentralized and churches are self-governing. They are held together by a holy synod of both bishops AND laymen (no women, of course). The patriarchs are now MODERATORS of the synod, and are not imbued with executive powers like the pope is. Also, there are many Orthodox churches that do not recognize or "report to" the Patriarchate, and they are considered to be perfectly legitimate. One example of a very ancient Orthodox church which doesn't fall under the control of the Patriarchate is the church of Mt. Sinai.

Now, the Patriarchate has, throughout much of it's history, fallen under control of the emperor/rulers who ruled the lands by force (for example, Justinian I, the rulers of the Ottoman Empire, etc). The patriarch of Constantinople never amassed the jurisdictional powers and privleges that the papacy in Rome did. The reason why is because of the autonomy of the churches in Russia, the Balkans, and Greece. The Patriarchate fought that, of course, because they did try to amass jurisdictional powers that Rome had. But the Patriarch of Constantinople was never able to centralize it's authority over the minority Orthodox patriarchates of Alexandria, Jerusalem, and Antioch. And then there are the seven national churches.

If you want to know the REAL story about JP's anti-communist stance, you can easily look at the history of the Bolshevik revolution and it's destruction of the Russian Orthodox church. That lead to a split of the Russian Orthodox church that continues down to this day. Not coincidentally, every pope of the 20th century has conveniently exploited this split (especially Pope Pius XII, who made a pact with Hitler to "fight communism"), in an attempt to suck the millions of Russian Orthodox Catholics into the Roman Catholic church.

JP's "anti-communist" ideology is deeply rooted in THAT political history of the battle between the Eastern Orthodox church and the Roman Catholic church, not the stuff of detente, glasnost, and Reagan's "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall" crap.