Justice and reason prevailed. Thank you Joe.

As to the ETWN link, I didn't think it was out of line to use a link to conservative organization, to explain the conservative side of the church's position on married priests. I had already early provided the link to a married priests website.

Some priests in the Eastern Rites are married too, as McGrath has pointed out. But JP's critics are talking about the Papal & Roman Curia's doctrinal position on married priests in general. The exceptions only prove the rule.

And it is good to remember that in the US alone, under John Paul II the church has lost 15,000 priests.

JPII also centralised power in Rome, effectively taking away the power the National Conference of Catholic Bishops in the US. Until the late 1980s, that group had been much more progressive and liberal in it's social justice teachings than Rome was, just like the Latin American Conference of Bishops was until JPII slapped them down too.

I don't hold out any hope for a liberal pope because this College of Cardinals is extremely conservative. But if we could get one in who allowed for some return of power and authority to the bishops, priests, and laity, it would at least be a start.

If the papacy is to have any relevancy internationally on the diplomatic scene, we desperately need a champion of the poor and a champion of social justice. IMO, John Paul II wasn't that sort of pope. He was more interested in hobnobbing with the political power brokers and celebrities, and being the "rock star" pope by packing millions into stadiums, than he was in championing the rights of the poor and social justice.

And BTW, when will we see the first environmentalist pope, hmmmmm?