about natal astrology: Sure, I can see that IF it all had any basis whatsoever, the more detailed the data, the more accurate the prediction would be..(that's why I made the point of 'where' in my example)

But then *daylia's* explanation that it is not a 'prediction', but a description of the "playing field", (leading to certain tendencies, I suppose) merely provides a simple disclaimer for charts that don't seem to 'fit'. If many other obvious factors can influence behavior, personality, conflicts, oportunities, etc....why include star positions at all? No one that I have ever read or talked to about this can offer an explanation of HOW such distant, minuscule 'influences' might work their spell. (and I still don't comprehend why the precision required is for the moment of birth, not conception. Aren't my influences, if any, already determined? Is there some auxiliary notion that my mother is in control until the umbilical cord is cut?...or is it that we seldom KNOW the exact time of conception, and thus the practitioners have just ignored this and use what is easiest?)

Telling me, as M.Ted does, that it's all potentially so complex and hidden from our perceptions that many things might be affecting us simply begs the question....his statements are true...but trivially
true. If 'X' might be true, so might 'Y', 'Z' and all the rest of the alphabet....and if a potential infinity of things might be true, then we have little reason to pick and particular set to latch onto.

   I have no doubt that there is much left to discover about the processes, chemicals, physics, biology, sociology etc...that make individual humans what they are, but the sort of attribution prevalent in astrology fairly reeks of gratuitous, subjective, artificial parameters. Discoveries that demand our attention and consideration because they specifically can BE shown to cause and/or affect certain aspects of Homo sapiens are one thing...presumed influences based on semi-mystical concepts invented by our remote ancestors to satisfy curiosity before they HAD modern science are quite another thing.

If, as *daylia* suggests, you "... find the ideas, insights and counsel offered at Astrodienst to be most wise and helpful anyway,...", fine. No doubt 'suggestions' about dealing with personal problems can be useful...and insights come in many forms. If flavoring your insights with an overlay of symbolism suits you..*shrug*. I like mine kinda bare....I'll salt & pepper them to suit, thanks. ☺