The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #101326   Message #2061224
Posted By: Barry Finn
26-May-07 - 04:34 AM
Thread Name: Lyr Req: Scottish Sea Shanties
Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Scottish Sea Shanties
To add to Rev's commentFrom Joanna Colcord's collection "Roll & Go" p.4 of the forword she states "Gross some of the words undoubtly were, when the shantyman choseso to improvise them; for the solo part of a shanty was largely "made up" by the shantyman as h went along"
SHe goes on "In improvising the solo part of a shanty, the leader or shantyman with originality & a reputation to maintain tried not to repeat the same line twice. If his story came to an end before the job was over, he fell back ona series of lines describing the piece of work under way, a common stock of which lines were used for "piecing out" on such occasions.

Capt Whall on p.xiii ofhis collection from "Sea Songs & Shanties" says while discussing indecent shanties; "The consequence was that in those ships the old time shanties were sung to their proper words, & most of the good ones had a story in verse that never varied, though in the long hoist, if the regulation words did not suffice, a good shanty-man would improvise to spin out."

Harlow in his collection "Chanteying Aboard American Ships" on p.2 says; "Many a chanteyman with a good voice but dull of comprehension would string out a chantey by repeating every line, using words with no meaning & sometimes without reguard to rhyme or meter. But if he were original, he would make up verses as he sang, bringing in incidents of the oyage in such a vivid way that the crew redoubled their efforts at the capstan bars or ropes, thus getting more pleasure from the work & keeping them in a contented mood"

Lydia Parrish in her collection "Slave Songs of the Georgia Sea Islands" in her chapter on 'Work Songs', p.199 goes on to say "In the old days, if no suitable verse came to mind for a particular task, one was made up then & there out of slender material".

Lastly Hugill in his "Shanties From The Seven Sea" p.30 He says of shanymen whose practice was not to work while singing as his job is to sing: "Of course the 'modern' shantyman didn't always pull his weight on a rope, he merely went through the motions, saving his wind for the song. At the capstan he 'rode the bars'". Hugill late goes on on p.32 to state; "Normally in an English-worded shanty the fact that the shantyman improvised, used verses from other shanties, or repeated the solos twice in each stanza, showed that he had an imperfect memory. Of course in a very long hoist the regulation verses would often run out & then stock phrases or verses from such a shanty as 'Handy, Me Boys' would be utilized. The process of repeating the solos was refered to as 'stringing out'. Many shantymen would, of course, improvise even if they knew the real words, perticularly if the ship was a 'hungry bitch', the voyage a tough one, or the afterguard a set of bullies. Improvising, they woukld bring out these tribulations in their solos".

As for my working the large downtown pumps once when leading a shanty I nearly lost my wind & from then after in modern style I only sing lead or work, I don't do both as you may assume.


"I doubt that the 107 year old Cape Horner was making songs up on the spot out to sea, perhaps in a shipyard but not out to sea."

George would've been about 107 if he were still alive today, when I 1st met him he was in his late 70' but he sang the yard up the mast as the rest of us worked the lines.
"I say this is so" & I see you prefered to call me a liar. Good day guest.
"Just because you say it's so don't make it so"

Barry