I wonder why there is this sudden outbreak of threads blaming BAD floor singers for all the ills afflicting folk clubs.

David el Gnomo sets pretty demanding criteria to qualify as BAD and is unfortunate to have two such people at Swinton. I don't think I've met that many in my life.

I'm with Waddon Pete ...I've yet to meet a poor performer who makes no effort to improve....

I wouldn't express myself quite as forcefully as skipy but I agree with his general drift that people need to look to their own performance before being quite so ready to condemn others. If you want to raise standards, the place to start is with yourself and not think "I can tune my guitar. I sing in tune. I can remember the words. Perfect. I'm far better than old Joe with his reed cutting song so that's all right."

The next place to look is at the booked guests. On the "Why folk clubs are dying" thread Faye Roche says The band were disappointing, but no more of that. WHAT? The booked guests who are taking up half the evening and getting paid for it were "disappointing"? If they can't be bothered to put in an adequate effort, why should the floor singers worry?

The idea seems to be that all the folk scene's problems can be solved by either silencing the "song stranglers" or organising workshops to bring them up to an acceptable level of mediocrity. Then the media will stop taking the piss, Arts Council funding will flood in and new clubs will be opening on every corner to accommodate the floods of new enthusiasts. Work on raising standards throughout then the BAD singers will improve as well or else they'll be an unimportant blip amongst the excellence.

Where can bad singers go? They can go to places where they can hear good performers who are capable of communicating their love of the music and making it clear just how much work THEY put in to achieve what they do.