The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #59418   Message #2619059
Posted By: Amos
26-Apr-09 - 12:38 PM
Thread Name: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
Rapaire has raised a bizarre string indeed.

""von" = any nobility (includes knights)
"zu" = higher nobility*, lost their name-giving place in the Luneville peace agreement 1801 or following years (Standesherren)
"von und zu" = higher nobility*, still owned the name-giving place in 1919

*- of Herrenstand, i.e. minimum Freiherr (baron)
The prefix "zu" was also awarded to the nobility that lost the territorial rule over their subjects due to Napoleon's radical changes to the German dukedoms and other small territories in 1803/1806 but retained the related title; unlike those who remained in power after 1815 (the Viennese Congress, as we all know) and bore the simple prefix "von".
"

Most, but not all, surnames of the German nobility were preceded by or at least contained the preposition von, meaning of, and sometimes by zu, which usually is translated as of when used alone or as in, at, or to. The two were occasionally combined into von und zu, meaning of and in approximately. (In general, the "von" form indicates the place the family originated, while the "zu" form indicates that they are still in possession of that place.) Other forms exist as well: von der (of the), vom (of the), zur (of the, in the, etc) and zum (of the, in the).

"Like nobles elsewhere, German nobles were acutely aware and proud of their superior social position, and often had disdain for commoners. As shown in Theodor Fontane's novel Effi Briest, they referred to one another as Geborene, or "ones who have been born", while commoners were called Geworfene, corresponding roughly to "whelped", "calved", or "foaled" in English, and properly referring only to non-human birth.
German noble families were almost always armigerous."


As the most armigerous of Mudcatters, Rapaire therefore thinks of himself as Geborene. Is it any wonder these poeple cracked up?


A