Lizzie, I think what Crow Sister is saying is not that these things are bad - of ocurse they aren't - but to highjack them and make them part of a fascist agenda devalues them and implies that those of us who have contrary views to these thugs - and who enjoy the diversity of food/culture/music/people which is part of the REAL Britain are being unpatriotic and subversive when, in fact, the exact opposite is true. For a view of the true diversity of England, look at the England In Particular website and the absolutely wonderful book that they produced.