And can we not fall into the trap of agreeing with Griffin about the status of conscientious objectors? I have a friend who regards any country which does not allow pacifists the right to abstain from fighting as not worth fighting for - and he would fight, granted that caveat. Allowing non-combatant status is one of the things that makes Britain worth being proud of, in my book, along with a lot of other traditions the BNP would regard as un-British. Like being open to those fleeing oppressive regimes like Hitler's.

Incidentally, I have spent the whole of my life not eating Hartley's jams etc because the MD of the factory would not allow the Pioneer Corps working on restoring it to functionality after bombing to eat in the canteen with the workers because they were conchies. (The Pioneer Corps did war work associated with the Royal Engineers, and would say that some were in it for their convictions and some for their previous convictions. They cleared bombed sites and collected bricks for rebuilding. And the clearing was not a nice option. Or safe.)

I'm not aware of the details of Jack Straw's father's war, but I have an uncle who had fled Germany, and spent time interned - no choice. (I think that was in WWI, but the same applies in WWII.)It is possible that the Straws were in the same boat. Don't forget that escaped Jews were interned in the same camps as Nazis and had to put up with antisemitic behaviour. Not one of the bits of British behaviour that is worth being proud of.

But whatever the truth, scorn for pacifism is not, surely, something we should allow Griffin to be right in. And it is not, in my experience, something that those who have been in active service share. The only person I knew do it in company had been in the Catering Corps.

Penny