Well, you could be right -- my knuckles aren't as deft as they once were back the last time I practiced the one-handed lift-off technique. !!

As for the brain mind argument, why no extraordinary proof is required. There are plenty of documented cases of people seeing imagery (mind-objects) for which the "owning" brain is far absent; this especially happens when very high affection exists, or when a close connection is under duress. There's plenty of experimenting that can be done within the bounds of ordinary experience. If you wanted really extraordinary proof, you would have to take a human being and do something really weird to him, like force him act repetitive in the same way that dustmotes and photons usually do -- talk about unnatural -- or expose him to conditions that undermine the phenomena you are trying to study. Weird, man. Or, something extraordinary in civilized circles, anyway, get him to reveal his most intimate perceptions and intuitive awarenesses, and then beat him up on the point, telling him he couldn't "possibly" be right. That's extraordinary.

Interesting, John, to think that two segments of the spectrum should seem mutually exclusive -- like two sound frequencies that just happen to nullify each other, or colors combining to vanish. I think that, in the range of human conditions ranging from stoner-dead to more alive than life, you encounter a lot of different "ways of knowing", some of which are direct, some of which are firmly locked behind mysteries and magic symbols, some which require solid efforts to bring about knowing (I'll belief it when I can pound it), and so on. It isn't just beliefs versus hard evidence. Anyway, the day is long and I am bound to retire for a brief turn on the other side of that wall over there.... :>)).

A