The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #151503   Message #3536895
Posted By: Little Hawk
13-Jul-13 - 12:06 AM
Thread Name: BS: Thoughts on 'Substitutionary Atonement'
Subject: RE: BS: Thoughts on 'Substitutionary Atonement'
What do we die for, Bill? Because it's the only possible way to complete this Earth-walk journey, that's what! ;-) You can't get out of this place without dying! I don't think you really want to hang around forever in an ancient body that's gotten so old and deteriorated that it's no darned good for anything anymore, do you? I know I don't.

A play dies when it ends and the curtain closes. The same with an embodied life. And that's just fine. It clears the deck so that another play can begin.

I very much doubt that anyone has ever died to wash away someone else's sins...Jesus included.

Of course, many people in history have been wrongly accused, wrongly convicted and then executed for someone else's crimes...but that's another matter entirely, and it's a result of people's mistakes or their deliberately corrupt machinations, not some kind of divine plan...IMO.

Jesus was wrongly accused, wrongly convicted, and wrongfully executed by the corrupt clergy of his time and by a compliant Roman authority who were very fearful of a possible rebellion in Judea. (a rebellion which came in a few decades' time) I have never thought it likely that the crucifixion was part of some divine plan to expiate the collective sins of humanity.

I can't say for certain about that...because I don't know for certain...but I consider it a highly unlikely possibility. His death was virtually inevitable, by the way, because he challenged the church of his time in ways that made it certain they would eventually seek his death...and I'm sure he knew that...but he wasn't afraid to die for what he thought was right. This has always been a characteristic of saints and other idealists throughout history...many of whom have gone to death for what they thought was right.

We honor them for it. We consider them heros. As we should. Among such popular heros are, for instance, Joan of Arc, Mahatma Gandhi and Patrick Henry, just to mention three widely separated examples of people who died bravely for their ideals.