The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #155357   Message #3670752
Posted By: The Sandman
20-Oct-14 - 09:47 AM
Thread Name: What makes a new song a folk song?
Subject: RE: What makes a new song a folk song?
Reynardine, Appears to have been a fragment , one stanza? according to whoever put it in wikipedia, and Lloyd apparntly did attempt to pass it off as a tradtional song . you stated that you did not think all broadsheets were folk songs, you a;so stated that it started off as a broadsheet, clearly Lloyd thought this one was and had no problem having an intention to write more and pass it off as traditional song aka folk song, basically the vast majority of it was a lloyd new song or composition. see here
Reynardine and Lloyd's contributions

According to folklorist Stephen Winick, although the name "Reynardine" is found in one 19th century version, the association with foxes, as well as Reynardine's supernatural characteristics, first arise in connection with a fragment of the ballad (a single stanza) that was collected in 1904 by Herbert Hughes. The source's recollection of the ballad was that Reynardine was an Irish "faƫry" who could turn into a fox. This ability (which is not suggested in any extant version of "The Mountains High") may have derived from the word "Reynardine": renard is French for "fox".

Winick points out that Hughes and a friend named Joseph Campbell (not to be confused with the mythologist) wrote short poems incorporating this stanza and the fox interpretation, aspects of which A. L. Lloyd in turn adapted for his versions of "Reynardine" (see Winick 2004). Winick also shows that Lloyd's versions incorporate several striking turns of phrase, including "sly, bold Reynardine" and "his teeth did brightly shine", that are found neither in the original ballads, nor in Hughes' or Campbell's versions.

Lloyd generally represented his versions of "Reynardine" as "authentic" folksongs (going so far as to claim to have collected the song from one "Tom Cook, of Eastbridge, Suffolk"), but this informant has never apparently been encountered by any other collector. Lloyd's claims have led to the current state of confusion; few modern singers know that the "werefox" interpretation of the ballad is not traditional. Lloyd's reworkings are certainly more interesting to the modern listener than the simple and moralistic original ballads, and have gained far greater interest from singers and songwriters; his versions of "Reynardine" have served as inspiration for many additional modern reworkings.

Modern versions of the song are performed on the albums Fire & Fleet & Candlelight by Buffy Sainte-Marie, Liege & Lief by Fairport Convention, Milkwhite Sheets by Isobel Campbell, Airs and Graces by June Tabor, Anne Briggs by Anne Briggs, Rosemary Lane by Bert Jansch, Weaving my Ancestors' Voices by Sheila Chandra, Arthur the King by Maddy Prior, Country Life by Show of Hands, Prince Heathen by Martin Carthy, Reynadine by Carolina Chocolate Drops and Dave Swarbrick, and Birds Fly South by Zoe Speaks, among others.