The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #158525   Message #3754761
Posted By: Jim Carroll
30-Nov-15 - 08:39 PM
Thread Name: BS: Jingoism or Commemoration
Subject: RE: BS: Jingoism or Commemoration
"but no doubt you will give us all examples of such moral judgements being applied "
You already have been given them but one more time for the less literate
ten million young soldiers and eight million civilian deaths (1.92% of the total population of those involved) all over a family squabble for land.
Anybody who can't draw a moral judgement from that is less than human - and I thought commemorating the war dead (liars) was a Christian thing!
Sorry - can't get your extremely badly link to work - but moral judgements on the war was far from "the only historians guilty of this despicable practice happen to be extremist right wingers"
The left, liberals, pacifists, Quakers, Christians, Communists Humanists, Fabians...... every shape and size of political thought have condemned the war on moral grounds - apart from the extreme right who justified it then and are still justifying it - the only ones refusing to do so are the extreme right - you pair being prime examples.
"Now where and when did either Keith A or myself say there was nothing wrong with sacrificing millions of young lives? "
Like now - you have always justified the war as being a fight for freedom against the tyry of those nasty Huns! - a crusade, in fact
" do believe that in 1839 when the Treaty of London was signed guaranteeing the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Belgium they did not have an Empire."
So what - did a piece of paper signed by politicians suddenly negate the the deaths of ten million human beings and miraculously turn th killers into "poor little Belgium" worth sending our young man to die for?
The war was fought for Empire and Belgium typified the nature of Empire at its very worst.
"I take it that you object equally to British assistance given to the Soviet Union in 1941 "
THe Soviet Union and Britain were allies in the war - Britain did not come to its assistance - it fought on the same side - 25.3 million Soviet citizens died during WW2 - by far the largest losses in the whole of the war.
Russia was opposing the rise of Fascism three years before the outbreak of war while Britain was chumming up to Hitler and trying to do a deal with him.
What are you on?
"Well that one worked out well for the Russians didn't it."
Doesn't matter how it worked out in hindsight - the Russian people said NO to the war, it transpired from the aftermath, that the German people would have also said no - Germany was plunged into revolution immediately the war ended.
Russia was not ready for revolution - it was forced on it by the soldiers refusing to fight and the combination of them and the workers and peasants refusing to accept the conditions brought about by a colonial war.
You want to discuss the Russian revolution - and its consequences - always happy to oblige.
Easter week helped prevent compulsory conscription and saved countless lives.
At least they tried to stop the slaughter.   
"More complete and utter nonsense – we learned from our cock-ups" - like **** we did, Gallipoli 1916, the wrong shells fiasco, the Soome offensive... how many lives did it take before enough men were sacrificed to finally win?
They were treated like hamsters in a wheel - well led my arse.
You are still bullying and blustering and saying fuck all - somewhat insecure childishness eh what.
Are you that unsure of your ground -good job you weren't a general (or a soldier for that matter)
At ease corporal Oakhampton!!
Jim Carroll