The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #31333   Message #3782633
Posted By: GUEST
01-Apr-16 - 12:53 PM
Thread Name: Help: Moorlough Shore
Subject: RE: Help: Moorlough Shore
This song is in Sam Henry's "Songs of the People", which contains songs from (or mainly from) the northern parts of Ireland. I remember seeing it (and the tune was indeed reminiscent of "The Foggy Dew" (which perhaps coincidently was I think written by someone from Kilcoo not far from Newcastle) and assumed that it referred to Murlough near Newcastle, Co. Down, Northern Ireland. I don't have the book in front of me so cannot remember whether Sinclair's Castle, Folly Hill, Warren's Point and Mourne Shore etc are mentioned though. Certainly "Mourne Shore" would to me imply a sea shore rather than an area near a river (I have heard of lake shores, but never river shores; river banks or river sides are usually the names given to the arae where a river meets land). There is also a Ballyedmond near Rostrevor, along the coast of the Mourne shore between Rostrevor and Kilkeel, Co. Down, not too many miles from Murlough, where there used to be a Balllyedmond Hotel (it was later bought by an Eddie Haughey of Norbrook Laboratories, Newry, a few miles away, who later became a peer in the House or Lords, taking the name "Lord Ballyedmond", but he was killed in a helicopter crash some years ago).

There is a lake called "Moor Lough" near Strabane, and also a Holy Hill not far away. No doubt flax was grown and there were bleach greens in the area, although as stated above, flax growing was formerly widespread over lowland areas of Northern Ireland (now extinct!). I have never herad of Sinclair's Castle, but clearly there were Sinclair's who were landowners in the Strabane area and may well have been involved in the Flax Industry. I don't know there was a Warren (or Warren's) Point in Co. Donegal, although one would have thought that emigrant ships would have left from the port of Londonderry which is not far from Strabane rather than a small port near Moville in Co. Donegal.

It seems to me that one could make a strong case for County Down or County Tyrone (I have no bias either way); however perhaps the mention of Sinclair's and the flax industry, which are pretty specific, swing it towards Co. Tyrone). If the latter are not mentioned in Sam Henry's book, could there be 2 versions, 1 from Co. Tyrone and 1 from Co. Down? (Though if so, perhaps the Tyrone version is the earlier of the two).

Certainly it can be hard to decide for certain on the origin of a song. There is a thread about the song Carrickfergus (to which I recently contributed) in which doubt was cast on whether "Carrickfergus" was the one in Co. Antrim, or somewhere in Co. Clare, where there is a River Fergus; Ballygrand" (or "Ballygrant") could have referred to a Ballygrant on the Isle of Islay in Scotland or a "Ballygrot" at Helens Bay near Bangor, Co. Down, and to me there was a plausible case that the "marble stones as black as ink" in "Kilkenny" could have been at "Kilmeny" on the Isle of Islay, where apparently there was a quarry with dark marble. There are though limestone quarries with a particularly dark grey limestone (though not "as black as ink") in Co. Kilkenny in S.E. Ireland; I have noticed this at a place called Ballykeefe near Callan, about 10 miles west of Kilkenny.

Other trivia associated loosely with the above:

(1) On a CD called "Tried and Tested"(released about 2000) in my possession by a group "Bawn Folk" there is an instrumental called "Maids of Mourne Shore" but I don't think the tune is similar to the one above.

(2) Murlough Bay in N.E. Antrim is just east of Fair Head, which is east (not west) of Ballycastle.

(3) As far as I know, the tune to "The Flower of Sweet Strabane" is also used for "Spancil Hill" (Spancil Hill is near Ennis, Co. Clare, in the west of Ireland), "Rathfriland on the Hill" (Rathfriland is in Co. Down, not too far from Newcastle) and another song called "The Hiring Fair at Hamilstonsbawn" (coincidentally, the group "Bawn Folk" mentioned above take their name from Hamiltonsbawn, Co. Armagh; this latter song also appeared on a CD released about 2000 called "Looking Back to Looking Forward"). It may also be used with other lyrics - this is a common phenomenon in folk songs, e.g. "Homes of Donegal" is the same tune as "Come All Ye Tramps and Hawkers", the latter being a Scottish song.

(4) I know the Holly Hill near Bellaghy mentioned above - my brother who used to live not far away for a year or two told me about it and I visited it a few times in the mid-1970s. Despite the name, the wood was mainly hazel, although there may have been some Holly. I must revisit it some time to see if the wood still exists. It is of course difficult to decide whether Holly" or "Holy" is meant; Holywood in Co. Down is pronounced the same way as Hollywood in California, though spelled differently. I think there is a Hollywood in Co. Wicklow, south of Dublin.

I wonder if the "Burden's Row" (which I note has a question mark beside it) mentioned above has any connection with the Katherine Purdon quoted by Pamela Sambrook (perhaps this is just a coincidence?).