Hi,

After work on Died for Love, there were several stanzas related to the Died for Love songs that also appeared in Madam I've Come to Court You songs; the Ripest Apple stanza and Wheel of Fortune stanza.

This study will try and get to the bottom of these humorous courting songs. There are many already in the DT and several good threads, however, the origin and relationships between the different versions have not been adequately studied. So this is my attempt.

What I need first are any old print versions, antecedents and broadsides- as well as traditional versions from the 1800s or earlier.

Here are some titles:

"Madam, I Am/Have Come to Court You" (Come a-courtin') NA/UK
"No, Sir" Eddy/Tolman
"O No John" sharp/Somerset
"Ripest Apples" UK
"Twenty Eighteen" Broadwood/UK
"The Spanish Merchant's Daughter" Stoneman
"The Spanish Captain" UK
"Spanish Lady" US/UK
"Yonder Sits a Spanish Lady" UK
"Yonder Sits a Pretty Creature" Williams
"In Yonder Grove" Sharp/ also Baring Gould
"Tarry Trousers" Irish/ Sam Henry
"Wheel of Fortune" Irish/UK
"Dublin City" Irish/UK
"Ettrick Lady" Scottish/UK
"The Quaker's Courtship" New England
"Quaker's Wooing" Barry/New England
"The (Lincolnshire) Handsome Woman" Boston/Roxburge
"Vandy Vandy" Manley from NC
"A Sport Song" Cazden
"Sober Quaker" Dorson/ Eddy
"The Lovely Creature" 1760 Broadside
"Madam, I'm a Darling" Frank Harte/Scotland
"She Always answers No" Peggy Seeger US

These are a few of the main titles. There are two Roud numbers: 146 and 542. The texts are mixed but Roud 142 is for "Spanish Merchant's Daughter"/"Oh No John"/"No Sir" even though the texts are mixed.

I assume "Spanish Merchant's Daughter" was adapted from an archaic "she answers no" version. There are several older versions with different text with the "No" answer. The concept is that the suitor asks questions that will advance his desire to seduce the lady-- even when she answers "no." A number of versions have this theme while others mix the "Madam" stanzas from the 1700s or just use the "Madam" stanzas.

Any old broadsides or print versions from the 1600s, 1700s and 1800s are welcome- then we can get into various versions.

TY

Richie

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This is an edited PermaThread, edited by Richie. Feel free to post to this thread, but please be aware that your posts to this thread may be edited or deleted.

-Joe Offer-