Hi,

Here's the 4th and last installment of "Seventeen" headnotes. It covers English and American versions, children's songs and other relationships. Here is the full text online: http://www.bluegrassmessengers.com/9-seventeen-come-sunday.aspx I'll try an have my painting done this week- and it will be online too.

4th part: "Seventeen" Headnotes

[The English Tradition
The English descent comes first from "The Maid and Soldier" broadside, a revision made in the late 1700s in Scotland. Three separate printings of the broadside were made c. 1820s in London and Birmingham. About ten years later a different revision titled "Soldier and The Fair Maid" was printed with a different opening and ending. Only two different "Soldier and The Fair Maid" broadsides from Yorkshire and Pocklington have survived. About the same time or shortly thereafter the standard "Seventeen Come Sunday" titled broadsides began to be printed with the same opening stanza (beginning "As I walked out one May morning") as the "Soldier and The Fair Maid." The ending which is sometimes varied slightly is different.

Here is a rare example of the early broadside (Soldier and the Fair Maid) text as sung by Bob Hart, from East Sussex, who was born in 1892 at Sotherton, a village near Halesworth. The following version sung about 1969 is from the recording, "Bob Hart - A Broadside (MT CD 301-2)." This version was probably learned in the early 1900s and is curious because it begins similarly to the Irish version by the Makems:

Seventeen Come Sunday

As I strolled out one May morning,
One May morning so early,
I met a dark and a handsome maid
And, me goodness, she was early--
Chorus: With her rue-dum-dah, whack-fol-lah
Whack-fol-the-riddle-iddle-li-ido

Her shoes were black, her stockings white,
And her buckles shone like silver.
She had a dark and a handsome eye,
And her hair hung down to her shoulders [Chorus]

How old are you, my fair pretty maid,
How old are you, my honey?
She answered me, so cheerfully,
"Oh, I'm seventeen come Sunday [Chorus]

"Could you love me, my pretty fair maid?
Could you love me, me honey?"
She answered me, quite tearfully,
"Oh, I can't because of Mummy [Chorus]

"But if you come to me mother's house
When the moon is shining brightly,
I will come down and let you in,
And Mother shall not hear me [Chorus]

So I went to her mother's house
When the moon was shining brightly.
She did come down and let me in,
And I stayed with her 'til the morning [Chorus]

She said "Young man, will you marry me?"
I said "Oh no, me honey.
For the fife and drum is my delight
And I'm happy as a soldier." [Chorus]

The "early" (fourth line, first stanza) originally was probably "saucy/sassy." It appears to be most closely related to the broadside "Soldier and the Fair Maid," which has an abbreviated ending. Versions related to "Soldier and the Maid" are rare in England. Aside from Hart's and the version by Amos Ash most of the English texts are based on, or similar to, the "Seventeen" broadsides which were widely printed and influenced tradition. This next version was collected by Percy Grainger, a pianist and composer, who collected ballads and folk songs in England during the early 1900s. Grainger collected a number of versions and this was perhaps his best-- it was used for his British Folk Song Setting Nr. 8 tune:

SEVENTEEN COME SUNDAY- from the singing of Mr. Fred Atkinson of Redbourne, Kirt on-Lindsey, Lincolnshire, Sept. 3, 1905

As I rose up one May morning,
One May morning so early,
I overtook a pretty, fair maid
Just as the sun was dawning

CHORUS: With my rue rum ray,
Fother diddle ay,
Wok fol air diddle i-do.

Her stockings white, and her boots were bright
And her buckling shone like silver;
She had a dark and a rolling eye
And her hair hung round her shoulder.

"Where are you going, my pretty, fair maid,
Where are you going, my honey?"
She answered me right cheerfully
"I've an errand for my mummy."

"How old are you, my pretty, fair maid
How old are you, my honey?"
She answered me right cheerfully
"I am seventeen come Sunday."

"Will you take a man, my sweet pretty maid
Will you take a man, my honey?"
She answered me right cheerfully
"I darst not for my mummy."

"Will you come down to my mummy's house
When the moon is shining clearly?"
If you come down, I'll let you in
And me mummy shall not hear me."

I went down to her mummy's house
When the moon shone bright and clearly?
She did come down, and let me in
And I lay in her arms till morning.

"Oh, it's now I am with my soldier lad,
His ways they are so winning.
The drum and fife are my delight
And a pint o' rum in the morning."

This version from Lincolnshire sticks closely to the "Seventeen Come Sunday" broadsides of the 1840s-1880s which helped popularize the ballad. Although it was frequently sung and collected in the late 1800s and early 1900s, a large number of melodies were collected where only a single stanza of text was bothered to be taken down or no text was written down at all. The text was either considered promiscuous or simply commonplace as based on printed broadsides. Certain prominent English collectors including Baring-Gould, Sharp, Hammond, and Kidson left most of the text off. In some of the versions they published-- the text was recreated or edited. Baring-Gould and his associates in Devon collected at least five versions but only one complete text is found in his MS. The text he published in 1892[38] was complete rewritten. Sharp collected at least 20 versions in England and a number in the US. Over a dozen melodies in Sharp's collection have no text or a single stanza. The version[39] he published in 1905 attributed to Lucy White, was in actuality a composite of collected texts, then edited. Composers Vaughan Williams, Butterworth and Grainger all collected versions with Grainger bagging nearly a dozen. These texts too were rarely complete. Because the ballad was considered bawdy and commonplace many good texts may have been missed. The ones that are extant in England are closely aligned to the Seventeen Come Sunday broadsides.

The North American Tradition
The North American tradition is varied and the "How old are you?' stanza and the "Fare thee well" stanza have become attached to other songs. The "Fare thee well" stanza has been adapted and become "Fly Around, my Pretty Little Miss" a play-party song and fiddle tune. Standard versions of "Seventeen" have been collected but most are short or fragments. The early song notes by authors such as Cox (Folk Songs of the South, 1925) and the Brown Collection (Belden and Hudson) associated "Seventeen" with "The Milkmaid" an entirely different courting song with a similar opening line (Where are you going, my pretty maid).

"Seventeen" has been collected in the US & Canada in a wide geographical area but has shown little of the popularity found in the UK. Only traces of the early Scottish form (Waukrife Mammy) have been found (see Sharp A and Eddy B). In North America the ballad is based mainly on the reductions, "Maid and Soldier" and the later reduction "Seventeen Come Sunday." Many of the North American versions are so short, missing critical stanzas, that an identification is impossible. This is the case in earliest extant US version which I've dated c.1850. It appears in Cox's "Folk Songs of the South," 1925:

"Seventeen Come Sunday." Contributed by Miss Bessie Bock, Farmington, Marion County; learned from her grandmother, a lady of Scotch-Irish descent, who learned it when a little girl and who would be eighty years old if now living.

1 "O where are you going, my pretty maid?
O where are you going, my honey? "
She answered me so modestly,
"An errand for my mommie."

2 "How old are you, my pretty maid?
How old are you, my honey? "
She answered me so modestly,
"I'm seventeen come Sunday."

3 "0 where do you live, my pretty maid?
O where do you live, my honey?"
She answered me so modestly,
"In a wee, wee cot with my mommie."

4 "Will you marry me, my pretty maid?
Will you marry me, my honey? "
She answered me so modestly,
"If it weren't for my mommie."

These core stanzas of "Seventeen" are missing both the opening and ending stanzas used for identification. The ballad may date to the late 1700s in North America when it was brought here by settlers but it was not printed and in general has lost its form. There are at least two US versions that are related to the older Scottish Waukrife Mammy tradition. The following version is No. 127, I'm Seventeen Come Sunday in English Folk Songs From the Southern Appalachians by Campbell and Sharp, edited Karpeles, 1932 edition. I've titled this "Sixteen Next Sunday" since "sixteen" is the age found in that and many older US versions. This text has the Scottish archaic ending, with the "moon is shining clearly" stanzas from the first revision, "Maid and Soldier." The opening is similar to standard "Seventeen" broadsides. The "She answered me, te hee hee hee" line is common in America but apparently has its roots in Scotland (see Duncan Williamson's version).

Sixteen Next Sunday- Sung by Mr. GEORGE P. FRANKLIN at Stuart, Va., Aug. 26, 1918. Hexatonic (no 7th)-- Sharp A

1. As I walked out one morning in May
Just as the day was dawning,
There I spied a pretty little Miss
So early in the morning.

Te loo - rey, loo - rey, loo - rey loo,
Te loo - rey, loo - rey Ian dy.

2 Where are you going, my pretty little Miss?
Where are you going, my honey?
She answered me, te hee hee hee,
I'm looking for my mummy.

3 How old are you, my pretty little Miss?
How old are you, my honey?
She answered me, te hee hee hee,
I'll be sixteen next Sunday."

4 If I come to your house to-night,
And the moon is shining clearly,
Will you arise and let me in,
If your mammy does not hear me?

5 I went to her house that night,
The moon was shining clearly;
She arose and let me in,
But her mammy she did hear me.

6 She took her by the hair of the head,
And to the floor she brought her,
And by the help of a hazel rod,
She made one wilful daughter.

7 So fare you well, my pretty little Miss,
So fare you well, my honey.
It's all I want to know of you,
You've got one darned old mummy.

Curiously all of Sharp's versions were collected in an area of Virginia that was featured in George Foss's article (short book), From White Hall to Bacon Hollow (http://www.klein-shiflett.com/shifletfamily/HHI/GeorgeFoss/whall.html). Versions of "Seventeen" have been found in the Appalachians, New England and Maritime Canada and have migrated west to Ohio, Illinois and the Ozarks. The ballad in its pure form (as related to the main British forms) is rare in North America. The following old version is from "Folk Songs of the Catskills," page 482 by Norman Cazden, Herbert Haufrecht, Norman Studer, 1982. This is a fairly complete version related to the first revision "Maid and Soldier" with several changes. It was collected from George Edwards (1877-1949) and his cousin "Dick" Edwards. George was one of Cazden's most important informants. My brief bio follows:

George Edwards was born March 31, 1877 in Hasbrouck, a small place on the Neversink River. George's father, Jehila "Pat" Edwards was a scoopmaker by trade but worked as an unskilled laborer. Pat loved liquor and would sing in bars for free drinks. He died in 1927. George's mother Mary Lockwood was the stable influence in his life. She was a singer, mostly of hymns. She died in 1925. George's cousins were Charles Hinckley and "Dick" Edwards, both singers.

"Where Are You Going, My Pretty Fair Maid?" Sung by George Edwards (1877-1949) and his cousin "Dick" Edwards about 1948; collected by Cazden.

1. Where are you going, my pretty fair maid,
And where are you going my honey
she answered me most modestly,
I'm on an errant for my Granny."

REFRAIN: With my rosy diddler dow, fal de diddle dow,
Whack! the dooey diddle die doe -dow.

2. May I go along, my pretty fair maid
May I go along, my honey?
she answered me most modestly,
I durst not for my Granny.

3. "You come along to my Granny's house
Whne hte wind blows keen and fairly,
I will arise and I'll let you in
My granny will not hear me.

4. Then I went to her Granny's house
When the wind blew keen and fairly;
She arose and let me in.
And her Granny did not hear me. (Refrain)

5. One day I met the pretty fair maid:
"It's cold and stormy weather."
She answered me most modestly,
"I am ondone forever!" (Refrain)

6. Now I have a wife in fair London town,
And why should I disclaim her?
[But] every town that I go in.
Get a girl if I can gain her. (Refrain)

7. Oh, come all you pretty fair maids,
Rises early Monday morning:
The bugle horn is my delight
And the sailor is her darling.(Refrain)

In the US there's a wide assortment of uses of the "Seventeen come Sunday" stanzas including several songs which use floating verses that are based on, or originated from "Seventeen Comes Sunday." Particularly popular is the "How old are you" stanza and another stanza which seems to be derived from the Scottish ending stanza which begins, "Fare thee well my bonnie lass." It has been adapted in the US and has become "Fare thee well my pretty little miss" and then "Fly around my pretty little miss." The "Fly Around" versions are mixed with stanzas from other songs and have become fiddle tunes, dance songs or play-party songs. The following titles are associated with these hybrids:

Fly Around My Pretty Little Miss
Fly Around, My Blue-Eyed Girl (Brown Collection)
Pretty Little Miss
Little Betty Ann (Sharp EFSSA)
Shady Grove (tune/lyrics)
Daisy
How Old Are You My Pretty Little Miss?
Wheevily Wheat (floating title, Lomax, Stith Thompson)
New Orleans (Bertha Beard, NC)

An adaption of the Scottish "Fare thee well" verse is found in The Skillet Lickers' "Fly Around" version on Old-Time Fiddle Tunes and Songs from North Georgia' County CD-3509:

Fare you well my pretty little miss,
Fare you well my honey.
If I'm not there by the middle of the week,
You can look for me on Sunday.

It's clearly taken from "Seventeen" and in the next evolution becomes:

Fly around my pretty little miss,
Fly around my daisy--

Another "Fly Around" song by Justus Begley in 1937 is titled "Fara You Well, My Blue-Eyed Girl" and has:

Fare you well my blue-eyed girl,
Fare you well my daisy

A stanza from Grammy Fish's version of "Seventeen" has the daisy" text[40]:

Where are you going my pretty maid
My little blue-eyed daisy?
I am not going very far
For really I am lazy.

Wheevily Wheat which usually has the "over the water to Charlie" stanza and the "wheevily wheat/ barley" identifying stanza has become a floating title with random associated stanzas-- some with the "How are you" stanzas of "Seventeen." As an example I give the Wheevily Wheat B version from "Round the Levee" edited by Stith Thompson, 1916. He comments:

Another version of "Weevily Wheat," collected by Miss Mary S. Brown of Gatesville, Texas, from Wallace Fogle, a famous play-party singer of Coryell County, runs as follows. The boys and girls line up opposite each other; the boys begin swinging at one end, and girls at the other, each swinging his or her partner.

Way down yonder in the maple swamp,
The water's deep and muddy.
There I spied my pretty little miss,
O there I spied my honey.

How old are you, my little miss,
How old are you, my honey?
She answered with a ha-ha laugh,
"I'll be sixteen next Sunday."

The higher up the cherry tree,
Riper grows the cherry,
Sooner a boy courts a girl,
Sooner they will marry,

So run along home, my pretty little miss,
Run along home, my honey,
Run along home, my pretty miss,
I'll be right there next Sunday.

Papa's gone to New York town,
Mama's gone to Dover,
Sister's worn her new slippers out
A-kicking Charley over.

Wheevily Wheat is a floating title but should have the Wheevily Wheat stanza(s) in it-- in the preceding lyrics Wheevily Wheat does not appear. The last line is a reference to "Bonnie Sweet Prince Charlie" who, in a bizarre twist, is part of Robert Burn's song that introduces "pretty little pink" also related, although randomly, to the "How old are you" songs in the US. "Charlie" is Prince Charles Edward Stewart, 1720-1788 and the related songs have the "Over the water to Charlie" lines. Here's a "Seventeen" version from Oklahoma that has the "Charlie" reference[41]:

My Pretty Maid- sung by Robert L Risinger of Norman, Oklahoma-- no date give, before c.1950.

1. "Where are you going, my pretty little miss?
Where are you going, my honey?
She answered me with a 'Uh, uh, huh,
I'm going home to mommy.'

2. ?How old are you my pretty little miss,
How old are you my honey??
She answered me with a 'Uh, uh, huh,
"I'll be sixteen next Sunday."

3. "Where do you live my pretty little miss,
Where do you live my honey?"
She answered me with a "Uh, uh, huh,
I live at home with mommy."

4. Will you marry me my pretty little miss,
Will you marry me my honey?"
She answered me with a "Uh, uh, huh,
I would if it wasn't for mommy."

5. "Where are you going, my pretty pretty maid?
Where are you going, my darling?
Down to the river to water my geese
and over the river to Charlie."

The following titles are play-party songs that are related by the use of similar floating stanzas:

Bile Dem Cabbage Down
Pretty Little Pink
Charlie's Neat
Coffee grows on white oak trees
Shady Grove

Here are two core stanzas of "Seventeen" used as floating stanzas in Tales and Songs of Southern Illinois by Charles Neely:

Come trip with me, my pretty little miss,
Come trip with me, my honey;
Come trip with me, my pretty little miss;
I'll be sixteen next Sunday.

How old are you, my pretty little miss,
How old are you, my honey?
She answered me with a "Tee, hee, hee"
"I'll be sixteen next Sunday."

Another association with the "How old are you" stanza is found in Child 243 Gypsy David/Davy (House Carpenter). This is the most popular House Carpenter text, as recorded by Carter Family in 1940-- and widely copied (originally recorded by Cliff Carlisle 1939, covers include Bascom Lunsford and later Doc Watson). Here are the first three stanzas, the second is the "How old are you" stanza:

Black Jack David

Black Jack David came ridin' through the woods,
And he sang so loud and gaily.
Made the hills around him ring,
And he charmed the heart of a lady.
And he charmed the heart of a lady.

"How old are you, my pretty little miss?
How old are you, my honey?"
She answered him with a silly little smile,
"I'll be sixteen next Sunday.
I'll be sixteen next Sunday."

"Come go with me, my pretty little miss.
Come go with, me my honey.
I'll take you across the deep blue sea,
Where you never shall want for money.
Where you never shall want for money."

The wide variety of titles songs that have borrowed the floating verses "How old" and "Fare-thee well" is confusing. The 1916 Texas version "Wheevily Wheat, B" was reprinted with additional stanzas by the Lomaxes as "Wheevily Wheat' in their 1940 book American Ballads and Folk Songs. The following example shows a composite of "Seventeen" and "Pretty Little Pink":

"New Orleans" sung by Bertha Hubbard Beard, recorded about 1970s. She was born in 1880 Alexander County, learned from her father.

I'll put my knapsack on my back,
My rifle on my shoulder,
I'll march away to New Orleans
And there I'll be a soldier.
CHORUS: Fal la linka do, oh do oh do,
Fal la linka do, oh di dee.

How old are you my pretty little miss,
How old are you my honey?
She answered me with a modesty,
I'll be sixteen next Sunday.
CHORUS: Fal la linka do, oh do oh do,
Fal la linka do, oh di dee.

Will you marry me my pretty little miss,
How old are you my honey?
She answered me with a modesty,
I'll have to ask my Mommy.
CHORUS: Fal la linka do, oh do oh do,
Fal la linka do, oh di dee.

I'll put my knapsack on my back,
My rifle on my shoulder,
I'll march away to New Orleans
And there I'll be a soldier.
CHORUS: Fal la linka do, oh do oh do,
Fal la linka do, oh di dee.

Well the coffee grows on white oak trees,
And the river flows with brandy
The streets all lined with ten-dollar bills
And the girls aa sweet as candy.
CHORUS: Fal la linka do, oh do oh do,
Fal la linka do, oh da dee.

The "knapsack" stanza is found in several composite versions and has the "soldier" which in the UK was included in the "Maid and Soldier" revision. "Coffee Grows" is a floating stanza usually associated with "Four in the Middle," a play party song. For more information about versions from North America see "US & Canada versions" and the appendix, 9B. Fly Around my Pretty Little Miss.

* * * *

The Case for Censorship
Patrick Weston Joyce, Baring-Gould and Cecil Sharp edited their published texts. James Reeves said this about "Seventeen" in his book The Idiom of the People (1958): "The original of this song, whatever it was, shocked all other editors, from the eighteenth century onwards." In 1958 it's probable that Reeves knew only Burns short version. There are 15 versions in this study (Aa-Ao) and after analyzing them it's clear what the original (the ur-ballad) was or approximately what it was. The ballad in the early original Scot form, Waukrife Mammy, is about a man who by chance meets a saucy young girl as he's "gaun o'er yon hict hict hill (the Highland hills)." He asks the lassie a series of questions which are designed to seduce her. The courtship dialogue reveals, among other things, where she's going, what her age is, and where she lives. At night he goes to see her at her mammy's house, and after lovemaking (Burn's sings, "she wasn't half as saucy"), the cock crows and wakes her mammy. When her mammy takes a coal from the fire to see if she knows him, he pushes her to the fire and runs out to the field to hide from her. The penalty for losing her virginity is a beating by her wakeful mammy with a hickory switch. The daughter is now pregnant in spite of her wakeful mammy.

Certainly the ballad story of a man who seduces a young girl and later serendipitously enters her house at night and takes her virginity was not considered morally acceptable behavior by many people. Patrick Weston Joyce (1827-1914) commented in his 1873 book, "Ancient Irish Music":

"I cannot tell when I learned the air and words of this song, for I have known them as long as my memory can reach back. Some portions of the old song are spirited and well adapted to the air; others are very rude and worthless; and for several reasons it could not be presented to the reader. I give instead, what may be called a new song, in which I have incorporated the best lines of the original, including two verses almost unchanged."

It's not clear whether Joyce is talking about "Seventeen" or the similar "I'm Going to Be Married on Sunday" since that title is associated with a different song. It would seem, however, that the "old song" with the questionable stanzas was the "Waukrife Mammy" version of "Seventeen." Baring-Gould, who knew both the Burns version and the Catnach "Maid and Soldier[42],"assumed it was "Seventeen" and lists Joyce's reworked song as a version. Here's the first stanza of Joyce's "new song" titled "I'm Going to Be Married on Sunday." His reworked text includes only the one key line from "Seventeen":

Twas down in the meadows one morning last spring,
I met a fair maiden who sweetly did sing
She was milking a cow while her clear voice did ring,
"O I'm sixteen years old on next Sunday,
I?m sixteen years old on next Sunday!?

The last line is clearly "Seventeen." The introduction of the girl "milking a cow" is found in a parallel group of different ballads which have different forms and titles, among them "Dabbling in the Dew" and "The Milkmaid."

The English forms of "Seventeen" were themselves censored revisions-- perhaps to make the Scottish text less specific. It is presumed then that "Maid and Soldier" and the "Seventeen" revision were sanitized rewrites of the main story. These revisions were not enough for some collectors. Sabine Baring-Gould, an Anglican priest from Devon, collected several texts including "As I Walked out" sung by Edmund Fry of Lydford, Devon in 1889. Baring Gould also knew Burns' text and a Seventeen broadside text and wrote them in his notebook. His published version (Songs and Ballads of the West, 1892) was reworked, using only just the first stanza here, to produce the recreation "On a May Morning so Early" attributed to Roger Huggins, at Lydford but reworked by Sheppard.

1 As I walked out one May morning,
One May morning so early:
I there espied a fair pretty maid,
All in the dew so pearly.
CHORUS: O! 'twas sweet, sweet spring,
Merry birds did sing,
All in the morning early.

The remainder of text veers further away from tradition and this recreation with its syrupy chorus doesn't resemble tradition at all. Cecil Sharp following Baring Gould example when publishing "I'm Seventeen Come Sunday" by Mrs. Lucy White, of Hambridge in Folk Songs from Somerset: Gathered and Edited with Pianoforte Accompaniment edited by Cecil James Sharp, Charles Latimer Marson, 1905. Sharp writes in his notes:

"The words have been softened and to some extent reconstructed by Mr. Marson."

Not mentioned in Sharp's notes is that Lucy White's melody is a composite of text from different informants. The text is not badly reconstructed by Marson and represents a variant of the standard "Seventeen" broadside text. Gone from the text is any specific reference to premarital sex. The "fair pretty maid" most properly marries the soldier in Sharp's text.

Whether the rationale for censoring texts of "Seventeen" versions by Joyce, Baring-Gould, Sharp and others is justified-- considering the foul murder ballads left untouched that they published-- is a matter of debate. The texts of Waukrife Mammy are not graphic or overtly sexual, since the sexual details are implied-- still the Scottish story itself and the age of the saucy lass who is sometimes just fourteen years old, is a cause of concern.

The Appendices, Associations and Related Texts, Themes
Two appendices have been created that are obviously based on, or similar to "seventeen." 9A. I Love my Love (Owre Yon High, High Hill) is Scottish and has a similar opening and theme as "Seventeen" but a different chorus. 9B. Fly Around My Pretty Little Miss is derived from the Scottish ending stanza (Fare-thee-well my bonnie, bonnie lass) which has been adapted.

A myriad number of associations exist. There are associations of "text" and "theme." The associations of text are primarily centered around the "How old are you?" and "Where are you going?" lines which are ballad commonplaces. Some textual associations exist in ballads with a similar theme. This is the case with the popular song, "The Milkmaid" (also titled "Farmer's Daughter") which begins with a series of similar questions (only first two stanzas which are similar are given):

"Where are you going, my pretty maid?"
"I'm going a-milking, sir," she said,
"Sir," she said, "sir," she said;
"I'm going a-milking, sir," she said.

"May I go with you, my pretty maid?"      
"You're kindly welcome, sir," she said.      
"Sir," she said, "sir," she said;
"You're kindly welcome, sir," she said.

Cox (Folk Songs from the South, 1925) and Belden/Hudson (Brown Collection 1952) grouped "Seventeen" with the Milkmaid-- an entirely different song. Perhaps "The Milkmaid/Farmer's Daughter" and the similar "Dabbling in the Dew" sprang from the opening question, a ballad common place: "Where are you going, my pretty fair maid(bonnie lass)?" The second question
"May I go with you, my pretty maid?" is occasionally but rarely found in "Seventeen" also (see: Jean Orchard's version). The ending of Fish's New Hampshire version has borrowed from "The Milkmaid"-- so there has been some blending.

"My Roving Eye (Ma Rovin' Eye, etc)" is used as a title for several versions of "Seventeen" and its name is derived from the chorus. It was first reported by Ford and that version of Waukrife Mammy dates back to c.1850 in Scotland. A similar chorus is used in some versions (Jeanie Robertson) of the Scottish song, "The Overgate," a different song.

The "How old are you" stanza in the US is found in a number of play-party variants-- most are constructed with floating stanzas from the "Pretty Little Pink/Coffee Grows/Fly Around" family and stanzas from "Seventeen" (see US & Canada Versions for details).

The Relationships with Child Ballads
The two Child ballads that are most closely associated with "Seventeen" are Child 243: The Daemon Lover (Gypsy Davy/House Carpenter) and Child 299: Trooper and the Maid.

The first revision of Seventeen (Maid and Soldier), dated late 1700s, introduces textual elements of Child 299 Trooper and the Maid including the Soldier replacing the lover and the line, "When the moon shines bright and clearly." Presumably the "Maid and Soldier" revision was created to sanitize the bawdy Scottish text and removed the "waukrife mammy" and other bawdy parts of the story. Further evidence of the use of Trooper and the Maid in this first revision is supplied with the addition of stanza 7 of "Maid and Soldier":

7. Oh! soldier, will you marry me?
Now is your time or never,
And if you do not marry me,
I am undone[ruined] forever.

This stanza is found in the "Seventeen" revisions and mirrors the ending of Trooper and the Maid. Francis J. Child seemed reluctant to include Trooper and the Maid in his ouvre of 305 popular ballads but he inserted it near the end as ballad 299. Surprisingly, no mention of "Waukrife Mammy" or any of the "Seventeen" ballads was made in Child's headnotes. The theme of Trooper and the Maid is not similar to the Scottish "Waukrife Mammy." The story as told by Child is[43]:

"A trooper (soldier) comes to the house of his mistress in the evening and is kindly received. They pass the night together and are wakened by the trumpet. He must leave her; she follows him some way, he begging her to turn back. She asks him repeatedly when they are to meet again and marry. He answers, when cockle shells grow siller bells, when fishes fly and seas gang dry."

This parallel but different ballad, Trooper and the Maid, became a small part of the "Seventeen" ballads with the first revision. It would not be until the mid-1900s with Seamus Ennis 1947 version that the two different texts would be blended. An examination of Child 299- B from the early 1800s shows some of the similar text:

'The Trooper' Motherwell's Manuscript, p. 27; from the recitation of Widow Nicol.

1.4: By chance the maid was in the close,
The moon was shining clearly,
She opened the gates and let him in,
Says, Ye're welcome hame, my dearie.

7    'O when shall we two meet again?
Or when shall we two marry?'
'Whem cockle-shells grow siller bells;
No longer must I tarry.'

The "Maid and Soldier" revision of "Waukrife Mammy" was made by the late 1700s in Scotland[44] and it was printed in the 1820s-30s in England. By the mid-1800s versions of "Waukrife Mammy" (see Ford's "My Rolling Eye") had incorporated stanzas from "Maid and Soldier." The two revisions ("Soldier and the Fair Maid" and Seventeen Come Sunday") which were made by c.1840 changed only the beginning and ending of "Maid and Soldier" but did not include more text from "Trooper and the Maid."

A.L. Lloyd, who titled his version of Seventeen, "The Soldier and the Maid" in 1956 on his Tradition album The Foggy Dew and Other Traditional English Love Songs, commented this in the liner notes:

    "The encounter of the licentious soldier with the obliging young girl was an old story when Roman troops patrolled the great wall between England and Scotland. For newer versions, listen to the gossip around any army camp, any day, anywhere. Of the many ballads in the family of The Trooper and the Maid, this is perhaps the best."

This comment by Lloyd and Ennis version "When Cockle Shells" which is a composite- first part "Seventeen" last part "Trooper" have muddied the water and a bridge has been erected between two very different ballads with only a brief sexual encounter in common.

In Child No. 243, James Harris (The Daemon Lover/Gypsy Laddie), there are several stanzas of "Seventeen" that have been found inserted into American versions titled "The House Carpenter" or "Gypsy Davy." This use was already mentioned earlier in the headnotes. Here are the first stanzas of "Black Jack David" obtained from Mr. Frank Irvin, Mascoutah, Illinois[45]:

Black Jack David came riding down the lane,
Singing so loud and gaily,
Making all the woods round him ring
To charm the heart of a lady,
To charm the heart of a lady.

"How old are you, my pretty little miss?
How old are you, my honey?"
She answered me with a smile and kiss,
"I'll be seventeen next Sunday.
I'll be seventeen next Sunday."

"Will you go with me, my pretty little miss?
Will you go with me, my honey?"
She answered me with a smile and kiss,
"I'll go with you next Sunday,
I'll go with you next Sunday."

The "How old" stanza is also in the popular Carter Family/Cliff Carlisle version of Black Jack David which was covered by a number of musicians from the 1940s on. In the US the "How old are you" identifying stanza has been attached to a number of different songs.

Children's Songs: "Haliky Daliky" "Where Are Ye Gaun, my Wee Bonnie Lass," "My Pretty Little Miss"
There are at least three examples of Scottish children's songs (game songs), my I, that originated in the early 1900s. The earliest extant version, Haliky Daliky dated c.1930, was collected by Ewan MacColl who commented in Folkways liner notes, (MacColl and Behan, The Singing Streets, 1958): "A ring game learned in 1957 from Sylvia Rapoport, a 36 year old London housewife who learned it as a child in the Gorbals district of Glasgow." A example of the song can be seen/heard by Stewart Cameron & Phyllis Davison performing a Medley of Scottish Children's Songs on Youtube.

Haliky Daliky

    Where are you going, my bonnie wee lass?
    Where are you going, my dearie?
    Where are you going, my bonnie wee lass?
    A message for my mammy.

CHORUS: Haliky, daliky, daliky dee,
    Haliky, daliky, dearie,
    Haliky, daliky, daliky dee,
    A message for my mammy

MacColl and Seeger also supplied a different version "Where Are Ye Gaun, my Wee Bonnie Lass" that they call a skipping song and ball-bouncing game in their 1986 book "Till doomsday in the afternoon: the folklore of a family of Scots Travellers, the Stewarts of Blairgowrie."

Children's Rhymes: Skipping songs and ball-bouncing game (e):

O, whaur are ye gaun, my bonnie wee lass?
Whaur are ye gaun, my dearie?
Whaur are ye gaun, my bonnie wee lass?
A message tae my mammy.

Chorus: A ha-cha-cha-chee, an' a ha-cha-cha-chaw,
A ha-cha-cha-chee an' a dandy;
A ha-cha-cha-chee, an' a ha-cha-cha-chaw,
A message tae my mammy.

O what is your name, my bonnie wee lass?
What is your name, my dearie?
What is your name, my bonnie wee lass?
My mammy ca's me Nancy.

Can I get a kiss my bonnie wee lass?
Can I get a kiss, my dearie?
Can I get a kiss my bonnie wee lass?
I'll hae tae ask my mammy.

One children's song, "My Pretty Little Miss" was collected by Owens in Texas in 1936. "Swing and Turn: Texas Play-Party Songs." The game instructions follow, "As all sing the first verse they move to the middle of the circle and then outward. They do this movement twice for the four phrases of the song. On the second stanza the boys swing each girl right and left, going around the circle until they reach their original partners."

1. Oh, come along, my pretty little Miss,
Oh, come along, my honey,
Oh, come along, my pretty little Miss,
I'll marry you next Sunday.

2. Oh, come along, my pretty little Miss,
Oh, come along, my honey,
Oh, come along, my pretty little Miss,
I won't be home 'till Monday.

3. How old are you, my pretty little Miss,
How old are you, my honey?
How old are you, my pretty little Miss,
I'll marry you next Sunday.

How old was she?
Although "seventeen" is known as the standard age that the pretty fair maid will be on Sunday, this is not the age in the older versions. The age of "seventeen" became standard after a large number of broadsides titles "Seventeen Come Sunday" or "I'm Seventeen Come Sunday" were printed in England beginning about 1840. In the first print version dated 1795, she is fourteen but will be fifteen:

What is your age, my bonny lass?
What is your age, my honey?
Right modestly she answer'd me,
I'm fifteen years come Sunday.

This is corroborated by other early Scottish versions (see for example Crawfurd). In tradition in North America and the UK her age is usually "sixteen come Sunday." The revisions "Maid and Soldier" to "Seventeen Come Sunday" more properly have her being sixteen and turning seventeen on Sunday.

Many of the Irish versions from the mid-1950s on and some other versions in the UK and US have Monday as her birthday.

* * * *
Some Conclusions
The four forms of A-D represent A, Waukrife Mammy, the original Scottish form from the early 1700s and the three revisions, B-D. The first revision, B, "Maid and Soldier" from the late 1700s introduced minor elements of Child 299, "Trooper and the Maid" into the story and eliminated the waukrife mammy. The last revision "Seventeen Come Sunday" added a happy ending where the maid becomes the soldier's wife and follows him to the battlefield.

Although few early Irish versions were collected, the Irish tradition is similar to the Scottish. Both borrowed from the "Maid and Soldier" and the later tradition in the early 1900s has, in most variants, separated from "Waukrife Mammy." In 1947 Seamus Ennis recorded an Irish variant "When Cockle Shells" (later titled "As I Roved Out") which was composite with Trooper and the Maid. This popular version, disseminated in part through his tradition Irish music radio program of the same name, was covered by a number of artists. Ennis' song entered tradition and a number of variants including "Night Visit" by Christy Moore have been recorded. The version is still popular today. A different version also titled "As I Roved Out" was recorded in Ireland by Sarah Makem. The Makem family long version is a recreation with revision stanzas and one from Waukrife[46]. The Makem version with its colorful chorus was arranged by Joe Heaney (a composite of Makem and Ennis) and sung by Len Graham and others.

The Seventeen ballads usually use a nonsense syllable chorus and have a number of different textual forms-- some with the last two lines repeated, some with the first two, while others repeat the last line after the chorus. Some choruses include "wi' my rovin'/rollin' eye" and a number of versions have been titled after this and other choruses. The choruses printed in broadsides are only one line, I assume as a reference-- in tradition the choruses were always longer. The print authors simply wrote a line indicating a chorus was to be sung-- but didn't write it out in full. This practice is corroborated by the 1795 print which gives the full chorus at the end-- while the first chorus is short.

The "Seventeen" ballads were not popular in North America in their original forms but the "How old" stanza and "Fare-thee-well" (Fly Around) stanza have been used as floating stanzas in play-party/fiddle dance songs. Here's a brief line of descent for the British versions:

British Line of Descent with four forms:

Waukrife Mammy (Scottish tradition/print) late 1600s-early 1700s Form 1>
   Maid and Soldier (tradition/print) late 1700s early 1800s (1st revision) Form 2>
      Soldier and the Fair Maid (print) c. 1830s (2nd revision) Form 3>
         Seventeen Come Sunday (print/tradition) c. 1840 (3rd revision) Form 4>
             As I Roved Out- Ennis (Irish Tradition) 1947 (Composite w/ Trooper and the Maid)
             As I Roved Out- Makem (Irish Tradition)1952 (Composite of several forms)

* * * *

In closing here's a version with core stanzas from down under as sung by Sally Sloane in 1956:
Listen: https://nla.gov.au/nla.obj-214812725/listen

'My Pretty Little Maid' sung by Sally Sloane (1894-1982). Recorded by John Meredith at Teralba, Australia on 16 June and 13 October, 1956.

1. Where are you going my pretty little maid,
Where are you going my honey?
Where are you going my pretty little maid,
Where are you going my honey?
She answered him quite modestly,
On erran' for my mommie.

CHORUS (after each verse): With my tu-rum ra, fal a diddle da,
Right fal-la-diddle dolly die, do.

2. How old are you my pretty little girl,
How old are you my honey, [repeat as before]
She answered him quite modestly,
I'm seventeen come Sunday.

3. Will you marry me, my pretty little girl,
will you marry me, my honey?
She answered him quite modestly,
"I dare not for my Mommie."

4. Will come unto my Mama's house,
When the moon shines bright and clearly?
O, I'll rise up and let you in,
And the auld woman will not hear me.

_____________________

Footnotes:

38. "On a May Morning so Early," an arrangement with rewritten text as taken down by Mr. Sheppard from Roger Huggins, at Lydford (Dartmoor, Devon); published in Songs and Ballads of the West: A Collection Made from the Mouths of the People by Sabine Baring-Gould, 1892.
39. "I'm Seventeen Come Sunday" in Folk Songs from Somerset: Gathered and Edited with Pianoforte Accompaniment edited by Cecil James Sharp, Charles Latimer Marson, 1905.
40. "Hi Rinky Dum," as sung by Grammy Fish of New Hampshire in 1940-- from Country Dance and Song, No. 9, 1978. Also Warner Traditional American Folk Songs and Flanders recording Track 20a, classification #: LAO17. dated 11-16-1940.
41. "My Pretty Maid" sung by Robert L Risinger of Norman, Oklahoma-- no date give, before c.1950. From Ballads and Folk Songs of the Southwest by Ethel and Chauncey Moore, 1964. This version is much older than 1964.
42. Both ballads were written down as versions in Baring-Gould's MS study (see online ).
43. Quoted from "The English and Scottish Popular Ballads," by Francis James Child; Volume 9: Ballads 266-305; Published August/September 1894.
44. This date is proved by the print of 1800, "Lady and the Soldier."
45. From: Tales and Songs of Southern Illinois, page 143, Charles Neely, 1938.
46. Although this has been discussed the family version was an extension of the original two stanzas recorded by Sarah Makem in the 1950s by friends (Clancy brothers) and family.

* * * *

Richie