The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #163826   Message #3916707
Posted By: Richie
11-Apr-18 - 11:07 PM
Thread Name: Origins: James Madison Carpenter- Child Ballads 2
Subject: RE: Origins: James Madison Carpenter- Child Ballads 2
Hi Steve,

I assume (but you known this better than I) that black-letter broadsides are dated before about 1720. Is that an accurate date? We know that earlier broadsides of Outlandish Knight (English) were printed-- they just haven't survived. How do we know EMUN did not have an earlier version? As far as False Knight Outwitted the British Library still has 1710? with a proven date of 1780. I have the ballad dated late 1600s and early 1700s without proof. There is a response in Notes and Queries challenging EMUN's claim (I think in 1868) that OK is the earliest predating the Scottish versions. EMUN's conclusion was also our conclusion.

I have felt that the fause knight exerted some power of her to cause her to go away with him besides the charm.

"I had no power for to speak one word,
No tongue to answer nay, nay, nay
No tongue to answer nay."

Still I agree that the False knight is not the devil and this change was added later to make him seem more ominous.

Richie