Bob Bolton: you're dead right to challenge me about which came first, Greensleeves or Italian music masters with their newfangled violins, as I'm sure it was a close run thing. For 100% sure,Greensleeves was widely popular in 1580, andit would only be speculation to try to guess how long it was around before then...though there is some evidence to place it back in HenryVIII's time(pre 1550). And the Italian new style fiddles were certainly being made by 1580, though not I think by 1550 . The word "violin" certainlyappears in English history from 1560 but as it was used indiscriminately for various different bowed instruments in those days we can't be sure it refers to the new Italian style instruments.So I admit I'm guessing, but I thinkin a reasonably informed fashion. Over to you, Bob. Can you place Italian music masters with modern violins in England pre 1580? Pre 1550? You made the assertion, you back it up. I'm always happy to be proved wrong (he said through gritted teeth)