Not just in the EU Tim, I thought the idea was to do away with nationalism worldwide, but as you say, no such luck.

Well I'll risk being scratched. I don't think we are "...missing the main point" Kat. Yes we do try and be civil to one another on the 'Cat, and that is exactly the point. I can't see how Sappers' original comment can be construed as derogatory about anyone here. If anyone here has murdered to advance their political ends, they have certainly not said so. As I said above, Sapper was quite specific, he referred to songs supporting the IRA / PIRA, not generically to anyone who supports Irish unity. If occasionally someone lapses into the vernacular, or writes conversationally rather than formally on a serious subject, I do not believe this should be attacked per se. The use of generic labels, derogatory or otherwise, for groups of people may have its own problems, but it would be very difficult to conduct a meaningful analysis or discussion without them, or as I said, to find a label or term to which no-one took exception.

I would also question your statement that "It is certainly possible to talk and write about the Irish conflicts without using derogatory terms". Like emotive terms, which are also derided by some as "clouding the issue" derogatory terms by definition depend on a personal viewpoint, and the fact that an article is published may say something about your skill as a writer, but has no implication as to how the words used are interpreted by a reader.

I don't want to belabour the point, nor do I wish to attack Mick, for whom I have the greatest respect, and I certainly don't expect anyone here to "lie down in the road"; unless it was to try and catch a 'possum; but Mick's reaction seemed to me to be out of character, both for him and the 'Cat in general.

I can't quote examples as I am at a client site and do not have the time to do an extensive search of the forum, but I'm sure I recall some equally "derogatory" remarks about people who committed torture and murder in pursuit of, to them, "legitimate" political aims in Chile, East Timor, Kosovo and Germany to name a few. The difference it seems to me, is that in these cases we were collectively censorious of the aims as well as the means.

Now if this fails to calm you down, how about a nice bowl of cream? Straight from the goat? Or a nice warm rabbit? You'll have to fight Bat Cat for that though; and the fires alight with a nice warm rug in front?

Pete M