I am going to give it one more stab. I am going to separate out my response here away from the issue of British involvement in Ireland. I believe that Sapper and I could have a very good debate on this issue, done in an intelligent fashion and interesting for the rest of you to read. I will respond to those remarks later, when I have time to give them their proper due and in the appropriate thread, probably BACK HOME IN DERRY or THE MAN FROM THE RUC. I have some strong disagreements on issues of fact as stated in the posts, but I feel that we can discuss them better in the appropriate thread. Based on Sapper's second post, I am certain that discussion will be done with respect and intellect.Sapper, so you don't think me a glib American with no background and who really doesn't understand, I would ask that you read those two threads. You will find that while I am indeed born in raised in the States, I am Irish raised and to the very core of me. I was fortunate to be exposed to the culture and ways of my people, and while I love the country of my birth (served honorably in her military), I love Ireland and consider myself to be an Irishman.

Now to the remarks that started our little Donnybrook. I will explain this, but I will not discuss it again as I feel it is getting away from the topic. There were two things that bothered me about Sappers post. The first was that he seemed to imply that when he goes to a folk club, he shouldn't be subjected to songs that were offensive to him. I would say that if you are going to a Wolfetones concert, or a folk club with Irish singers, you are going to hear songs like "Sean South" or other songs that glorify the fight. If you are in a folk venue, you are going to hear it. But more importantly, and the reason I responded harshly, is that I was offended and continue to be offended by people that further the impression that the terrorism in the North of Ireland is all IRA sponsored. Joe Offer did this in a thread, I believe it was the Colorado thread, and I didn't correct him because at the time we were discussing such a tragedy that I felt I would leave it out. I said this before and it bears repeating. If Sapper had come on and said he found songs that glorified the IRA inappropriate in a venue where there were British soldiers, I probably wouldn't have said a thing. But the minute he politicized it and took a position, and started the name calling in a worldwide forum, that he should have known would have Sinn Fein supporters and Republicans in it, he showed the same disregard for me that he claimed he had to suffer. I will not get into the debate here about my views of the IRA. We will do that in another thread. But I will not allow here or anywhere else that I see it, such statements to go unchallenged. I repeat, when Sapper went from objecting to Pro IRA songs to judging them and acting like all else didn't exist, he had to be challenged. I stand by my reaction to his comments. And I appreciate, and look forward to his input on the subject in the other threads. I find it interesting, Joe and Shambles, that you were immediately concerned for his feelings, with no regard for mine. I do not believe I have changed anyone's mind here, so I am requesting that we let this issue die now, and agree to disagree.

Mick