The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #56559   Message #892088
Posted By: Teribus
17-Feb-03 - 11:33 AM
Thread Name: BS: Should the Uk & US go to war with Iraq?
Subject: RE: BS: Should the Uk & US go to war with Iraq?
bbfSS,

Thanks for the link (ww.thememoryhole.org). At first glance it appears fairly damning, but did you go to the links supplied to the articles from the "Independent", "Financial Times" and "Guardian". No mention of German companies being Iraq's most numerous supplier, the way the front page of your link has it that is the USA with 24 companies named - the number of German companies is 80. The articles go on to say that American companies stopped dealing with Iraq in the mid-eighties, the German companies have continued up to the present day.

They reckon that the names were leaked by Iraq to embarass the US, German, British and French governments with the information. Much of the story contains old news, 1975 to 1985, and large sections relate to so-called "Dual Use" material and equipment.

On the subject of "Dual Use" equipment, here's an example:
"American weapons experts have recently voiced concern that the German Government has permitted Siemens to sell Baghdad at least eight sophisticated medical machines which contain devices that are vital for nuclear weapons. The machines, known as "lithotripters", use ultrasound to destroy kidney stones in patients. However, each machine contains an electronic switch that can be used as a detonator in an atomic bomb, according to US experts. Iraq was reported to have requested an extra 120 switches as "spare parts" during the initial transaction."

From Forum Lurker:

"Iraq's conventional weaponry is mostly Russian in manufacture, which is true of many Third World countries. Their chemical and biological weapons, on the other hand, were initially supplied by America for use against Iran."

I served in the Royal Navy mid-sixties to mid-seventies, in all that time I never once saw any reference to the handling of chemical, biological or bacteriological weapons or ordinance, we had procedures for everything else (Armour Piercing, Semi-armour piercing, High Explosives, Star Shells, ECM rounds or "chaff", various types of missiles - but nothing relating to CB weapons). I think it was Harold Wilson's Government that officially and unilaterally renounced the used of such weapons years ahead of the 1972 Convention. Our RFA's supplied US Navy ships - again no special instructions for the handling or storage of such munitions. The Russians were supposed to have signed up to the Convention but didn't. UK had already given them up, the United States kept their existing stockpiles until they decayed or were destroyed. The US and NATO (cold war NATO that is) never went down the road of chemical, biological and bacteriological weapons because they are totally indiscriminate and terribly unreliable. The NATO response had Russian and Warsaw Pact forces attacked the West with CB weapons was the use of Tactical Nuclear weapons - that proved deterrent enough.

MGOH's link again reads more into the situation than there actually is. While US, UK and NATO do not have chemical, biological and bacteriological weapons, they have to carry-out research in order to develope means of protecting their forces against the effects of those agents. That requires developing cultures and samples - that is what the US sent to Iraq during the Iran-Iraq war - they did not send weapons. There are currently 180 registered centres in the world that deal with these materials, most are signatories of the non-proliferation treay - there are thirteen countries who have this stuff as weapons systems who are not signatories.

Of the middle-east countries today, the best organised, most efficient and best equipped armed forces are those of Israel. The largest armed forces in the region still belong to Iraq - even after the Gulf War. Their main suppliers as previously stated are:

Armour - Russia and China
Aircraft - Russia, China and France
Artillery - Russia and China
Missiles - Russia, China and France
Small Arms - Russia and China