A lot of the most interesting (to me, anyway) threads on The Mudcat are ones involving the origins of songs and other folk traditions. I can understand it if this doesn't really turn you on, enjoying this is by no means the same thing as singing the songs and certainly no substitute. Many of us do, however, have a natural curiosity about these things and - like I say - I find it thoroughly enjoyable when I learn something new about how a song came to be.

Occasionally, some of these discussions, which by their nature involve speculation in our attempts to make sense of the information we have, are blighted by a misunderstanding of the nature of evidence ... particularly about dating. On the one hand there are those who, without any evidence at all, tend to assume that the origins of a song go back into the bowels of time. On the other are those who, having found what they feel is the earliest printed version of something, insist that it cannot possibly be older.

In an attempt to expose both these fallacies I'd like to propose that we use a methodology, and the associated terminology, which Archaeologists have been using for some time to rid themselves of inappropriate influences.

Here they are, with explanations.

Terminus Post Quem / Terminus Ante Quem

These two Latin terms are used by archaeologists to describe the relationships of objects to layers and other objects found in the ground. The dictionary definition of terminus post quem is the 'starting-point of a period'; that of terminus ante quem is the 'finishing-point of a period'. They are very important concepts, fundamental to the understanding of the development of an archaeological site and to the working-out of its likely date.

In archaeological usage, a datable object such as a coin found in a layer can only give the date after which the layer in which it is found was formed, and this could be any time after this date if there is nothing to indicate otherwise. This circumstance would be designated terminus post quem.

However, if a layer is cut by a ditch or other feature, then the layer must be earlier. The layer will thus have a date earlier than any datable objects in the layers or features above. This circumstance would be designated terminus ante quem.

Of course, if an object such as a coin has a date of minting on it, then an exact date is available. This dating is known as a Terminus Ad Quem - literally the fixed point at which something must have happened. Terminus Ad Quem dates are often available for songs from sheet music, though care must be taken that the claimed author and date are, in fact, the real author and that no earlier versions exist. An example of a fairly clear Terminus Ad Quem for a folk song is "Molly Malone", which was originally published as "Cockles and Mussels" Comic Song. (Written and composed by J. Yorkston, arranged by E. Forman.) Yorkston, James 1884.

:-)