How long does it take you?

Subject: How long does it take you?
From: Cappuccino
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 07:38 AM

Something that has always bugged me about playing guitar is changing strings... it's always been a chore. And I can never make up my mind how much of the unwound strings to poke through the little hole, either.

So today I timed myself on a fairly relaxed six-string change, while having a cuppa and watching the World Cup draw.

Sixteen minutes. Not a time you'd like to take in the middle of a show, of course, but how quickly can you guys change a set of strings?

- ian B

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Tweed
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 07:50 AM

HAW! Here's another thing I know somethin' about. It takes me about a half hour to forty minutes to change strings, by the time I stretch the crap outta each one and retuning between stretches until they don't lose tune anymore. It takes longer to change but the strings stay in tune much longer.
As to how much to add before you make the fatal bend at the peg, I discovered a natural string guage on my own hand. I attach the string at the bridge and lay it up over the post and add the distance of the first two segments of my ring finger from the post to the point of the bend. Gives me about three and a half wraps around the post every time.
I got a telecaster with the old style tuning posts that you insert the wire in the center of the post and for that I use the whole length of the ring finger to allow for the extra inch that goes in the post.

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Cappuccino
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 08:10 AM

Honest, Tweed, I used to play behind a guitarist in an Irish folk band who didn't stretch them AT ALL. Straight through the peg as far as they would go, then tighten. The only guy I've ever known to bust four or five strings a night, regular as clockwork.

- Ian B

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Tweed
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 09:54 AM

Geez Ian, I hope you guys had a good storyteller on hand!

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Art Thieme
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 10:27 AM

"Tom Joad" done s-l-o-w-l-y and unaccompanied was always good for putting on a broken string.

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Art Thieme
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 10:29 AM

...then I'd tune up and finish the song pickin' behind the last 2 verses. Good for two encores.

Art

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Rolfyboy6
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 10:34 AM

It's a chore. I use the longer method too. I pull on the strings to stretch them. I always try for at least three wraps around the post too. Then I have to go away and let the strings go out of tune, and re-tune, and then do it again. My twelve string just drives me to total impatience. I use the width of my four fingers as the extra amount for post winding. Thank god for string winders, otherwise my strings would get changed much less often.

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: WyoWoman
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 11:48 AM

As long as it takes me to find someone who knows how to do it and promise him Dove bars if he'll change my strings for me. Theoretically I know how, but in practice, I still haven't mastered that part of my guitar education. (But then, I'm still learning how to use a pick, so it's not as if i"ve been at this forever ... )

But this is why it's nice to be able to carry a tune without accompaniment, yes? Or to have a close, personal singer who can.

--ww

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Mooh
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 12:08 PM

The older I get the more time it takes, but the more enjoyable it is. It's the old "It takes me all night to do what I used to do all night" syndrome. Then again...

What's that you say? This is about changing strings? Maybe I should read the posts...

10 minutes, tops.

I was getting excited.

Mooh.

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: rangeroger
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 01:02 PM

I've never really timed myself, but I kinda enjoy changing strings.For length on the tuner,I use my middle finger at the 12th fret as a guide, holding the string with my thumb.I then thread the end through the peg until fairly tight. Then I wrap the string backwards around the peg,come up under where the strings enters and pull up the end. At that point I wind the string until it is tight,tune to pitch, and the pull on the string to stretch it.Retune, stretch again.When all the strings are on, I pull to stretch and retune again.

It really doesn't take that long and the backwards wrap at the peg serves to lock the string under itself, stopping any slippage.

It may be a function of my particular guitar and the strings I use,D'Aquisto Brass Masters, but my guitar says in tune for long periods of time.So much so that I can carry it in the case to a campsite session, pull it out, and be in tune with those already playing.

Assuming,of course,that they are in the proper state of tune to begin with.Sometimes it takes a couple shots of single-malt tuning fluid to get it there.

rr

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: breezy
Date: 01 Dec 01 - 01:39 PM

I change guitars, 10 secs max.

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Cappuccino
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 12:32 PM

That's rather like buying a new car 'cos the ashtray's full!

- IanB

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 12:42 PM

16 minutes to change strings, Ian? Not bad. Heck, it takes me 10 minutes -
to change chords....
-Joe Offer, slowpicker-

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: WyoWoman
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 12:46 PM

Don't you think part of the pleasure of getting older is that we enjoy the process more than the actual event? "Baby I'm built for comfort, I ain't built for speed ..."

Ahem ... getting back to the guitar string part of the program: The part that hangs me up is trying to figure out which direction to get the strings started. I have now strung the high strings wrong twice, which is why I now just try to find the likeliest looking man and ask him to trade chocolate (or beer) for stringing. I know this is ferociously dependent, but it's sort of nice not to have to do EVerything by myself ...

ww

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 12:53 PM

JOE OFFER...10 points!

I can change 'em in about 6 minutes IF NUTHIN' GOES WRONG!

...but something always does (like stickin' a wire straight through your finger) or discovering the one string you're replacing ISN'T in the package ('cause you took it out three weeks ago, promising to replace it the next day)

Usually I have at least two instruments on stage with me, so I ask a friendly face in the audience (most audiences are fifty percent musicians) to change it for me.

Bummer, anyway. Tom Rush (who broke a lot) used to tell long shaggy dog stories.

Rick

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Louie Roy
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 01:15 PM

If you can afford the price of a cheap battery operated screw driver,some less than ten dollars and the tool that fit over your winder this costs one dollar and an electric tuner you can change a set of string in 5 minutes.Also when bringing your strings up to pitch with this screw driver bring the string up one note higher than necesary and by the time all the strings have been attached the first string youstrung will be nearly in tune.I carry this in my case all the time plus a pair of dikes to snip off the excess Louie Roy

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Mooh
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 01:38 PM

Wyo. Right on...(let me clear my throat)...I'll change your strings anytime...Mooh.

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: 53
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 08:12 PM

good question, i have never really timed myself, but i use a string winder to loosen them and iuse my hand to tighten them back up once the new ones are on. i usually take all off then clean the fingerboard sometimes with lemon oil and then i put the new ones on, and tune a couple of times and she's ready to go. BOB

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: WyoWoman
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 08:13 PM

Fer chocolate or fer beer? Or just for the thrill of the ... process ... ?

ww

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Mooh
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 08:41 PM

The thrill of the...chaser...

Yours, Mooh.

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Justa Picker
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 08:46 PM

Since I don't perform on stage, I am not concerned with the "speed" factor in how quickly I can change them. Rather for me, it is an enjoyable ritual / exercise, and generally takes 35 - 45 minutes.

I start by removing all the strings at once. And then get a soft, flannel cloth and give the entire instrument a good rub down, especially the fingerboard area. If the top, sides and back feel particularly dry to the touch or are just smeared with finger or sweat marks, I will apply a few drops of Hawes Lemon oil to the cloth and work that into the top and sides and then wipe it all down again with a dry, clean cloth.

I don't apply lemon oil to the fingerboard. Instead once a year I'll put a couple of drops of tung oil on a cloth and work that into the fingerboard, wiping it off fairly quickly and then rewiping it down with a dry cloth, just to moisturize it ever so slightly so that in the winter there's no danger of the wood drying out and developing cracks. As well, I refill the Dampit humidifier in my guitar as well as the one I keep in the case along side of the guitar's neck.

Once the cleaning and polishing has been done, I then restring one at a time, starting with the low E, then A, and D strings. I make sure they're tuned to pitch before cutting off the excess with wire cutters, and then I retune them again. Then I add the high E, B, and G strings, again repeating the tuning process before cutting those excess string lengths. I then make sure all the strings are tuned to standard pitch and put the instrument back in its case to let the strings stretch and work themselves in until the next time I'm ready to get it out and play.

Sure if I wanted to, I could change the strings in 10-15 minutes, but my method gives me a chance to really examine the guitar, polish it, and make sure there are no structual anomalies forming. I consider them all my "ladies" and like to take my time with each one of them. None of this wham, bam, thankyou m'am restringing stuff. **G** I generally change the strings every couple of weeks as I tend to play one of them at a time for a couple of weeks and then rotate to the next. My habit seems to be that when I change the strings on one and clean it, it then goes back into its case, and I pull out another one to play for the next couple of weeks.

Nice thing is that with this "system" every time I take a guitar out to play, it always has new strings on it. Another nice thing which I happen to like about using the Hawes Lemon oil, is that over time, it will darken the top and add to that "aged" look which I am partial to. Others might not like that look, but I do like that dark brownish, orangey twinge...which over time will develop naturally anyway, but the lemon oil accelerates the process some. Pure lemon oil in no way hurts the wood, and I prefer it over various waxes, and silcone based polishing sprays.

Subject: RE: BS: How long does it take you?
From: Sorcha
Date: 02 Dec 01 - 09:11 PM

Forever and a freakin' day..........fiddle, not guitar. Maggie has geared tuners like a guitar/banjo instead of friction pegs. Nobody makes a string winder for fiddles and I am afraid to cut off excess before I start winding......I KNOW I would cut it too short. If I break one in public, it takes about 4 tunes to change one string---15 mins.??? Takes half a day at home to change all 4 and get them stretched to stay half way in tune. The things are still a booger for a week. Consequently, I don't change strings nearly as often as I should.

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: rangeroger
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 02:18 AM

WyoWoman, do we have to pay you the beer and the chocolate?

rr

Subject: How long?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 03:42 AM

Pit-stops?? To change all the stings on just one axe, and replace the pre-amp battery while I can get my hand into the sound hole... maybe 10-15 minutes if I had to...

Wraps around the pegs? Well, I also use the 'Middle finger at the 12th fret' guide mentioned above... and I end up with 2 or 3 wraps of wound strings, and 4 or 5 of unwounds... which is more than enough...

Tuning/stretching them... well, usually by the time I've yanked on them a couple of times and tuned 'em slightly sharp while putting them on, they are fine... if, during a show I have to replace one string, I have no problem at all 'tweaking' it up as it slackens while I'm playing... Ya gotta know yer gear ratios really well for that one though...

Quickest string change? Replaced a broken D string on stage with the band while singing chorus harmonys to "Rolling Down To Old Maui" being sung about twice as fast as it should be... Including clipping the end of the string so it didn't take someones eye out during the rest of the show...

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: Cappuccino
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 03:57 AM

What's the Lemon Oil for? I've never heard of it. And what's 'tung oil', please?

Although on second thoughts I have a horrible suspicion they may be something to do with the negotiations going on between Wyo and Mooh...

- IanB

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: Tweed
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 07:58 AM

Here's a clicky to Stewmac.com's page for their tung oil. You don't need a lot on the fretboard and I'm told it shouldn't be used more than a couple times a year. It just keeps the wood from drying out and helps to preserve it. I don't think it would be a good idea to use this product for intimate encounters as I'm pretty sure they're talking about putting it on plain old every day wood...;~)
*blue clicky tung oil thing*

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: JudeL
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 08:25 AM

If you ever get the chance go & see a guy called Nick Harper, he's not quite folk but he is a very entertaining guitarist. He's the only guy I've seen who having broken a string in the middle of a particularly enthusiastic guitar piece, didn't even blink an eyelid. He just grabbed another string out of his case one and restrung it. He didn't stop playing he played around the broken string until it was usable again. By the time the piece was finished he had a full set of strings again. The first time I saw it I thought it was a fluke - but it would seem it's his party piece as It happened (in a diffent song) again the next time I saw him!

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: Mooh
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 08:49 AM

Wyo,

Candy's dandy but liquor's quicker, and all that. Quit drinking a year ago (I know, I know, no more fun...), so it'll have to be chocolate.

I can dream, can't I?

Mooh.

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: Cappuccino
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 01:18 PM

I'm still mesmerised by the thought of tung oil.

Not a string change, but similar... I saw a rock band in Scotland some years back, where the drummer was bashing seven bells out of his kit (or, in the local dialect, 'gi'in' it laldy'!) and one stick came out of his hand and flew over the front line to land at the guitarist's feet.

The guitarist played a power chord, then reached down with his right hand, picked up the stick, and tossed it over his shoulder...

... where the drummer caught it and carried on.

Now, back to tung oi.

- Ian B

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: 53
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 01:51 PM

if you put to much lemon oil on the fingerboard, over time it will cause the wood to soften, be careful about the amount of lemon oil you put on it, i put lemon oil on mine about once every 6 to 8 months. BOB

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: Justa Picker
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 02:00 PM

I don't use lemon oil on the fingerboard. Only the top, back and sides.

As for tung oil (here is some more info) you have to use it very sparingly, and once a year is enough. You apply it lightly and wipe it all off starting about 30 seconds after you apply it. If you leave it on longer than that, it will make the fingerboard very sticky and it's a bitch to get off once its gets to the "sticky" point. I wouldn't have known about it until the luthiers at the vintage shop I deal with swore by it and instructed me on how to apply it, and they reiterated what BOB said about NOT using lemon oil on the fingerboard. These guys are extremely knowledgable about luthiere and guitar maintenance matters, so I felt I could trust their expertise. They've never steered me wrong about anything.

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: SharonA
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 02:08 PM

When I took the tour of the Martin Guitar factory in Nazareth, PA (that's near Bethlehem, PA, oddly enough!), I watched a factory worker stringing a new guitar. I wish I'd timed him, but he certainly took less than one minute per string (including some stretching). Honest!

'Course, he gets a lot of practice at it. It was quite an impressive performance, anyway!

Me, I take a good twenty minutes to a half-hour, while removing my glasses so I can thread the string through the hole, replacing the glasses to find the next string, pricking my fingers, blotting the blood, etc., etc.

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: ddw
Date: 03 Dec 01 - 11:13 PM

IansB ——

Remember the Wesson oil parties back in the '60s?

Well, tung oil is what you use when you do it with guitars.

OK?

*BG*

david

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: Mooh
Date: 04 Dec 01 - 08:40 AM

Seriously, I haven't oiled a fingerboard in 20 years. I stopped when someone told me I was oiley enough myself. Once or twice a year I'll degrunge a set of strings with some Fret Ease (or whatever it's called) but I'm careful not to get much directly on the fingerboard. I figure any kind of oil promotes the collection of grunge, and I'm sure I'm dirty enough. Even less frequently I clean the 'boards.

Mooh's 2 cents.

Subject: RE: How long does it take you?
From: 53
Date: 04 Dec 01 - 09:10 PM

my luthier recommends using lemon oil on the fingerboard, but only sparlingly, just a picker that's the first time i've heard about not using lemon oil on the fingerboard. BOB