David Kidman: An Apology

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Tyke
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 12:27 PM

Hi Joe and welcome to the Mudcat! A comedy handsake oh I don't know when you see all and sundry coming out of the gent's still fastening their Fly's after not washing their hands. What about a Funny Walk?

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Tyke
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 12:22 PM

Dave has quiet rightly put the record straight! Making it clear that his Mudcat or pen Name is MoorleyMan. I for one did not know MoorleyMan and Dave Kidman were one and the same.

All this could have been avoided if the Club Organizers had got off their Fat Backsides and told everyone that they had been lucky enough to obtain the paid services of David Kidman to do an extended Floor spot. Perhaps they did not want the clubs other Floor Singers to know that money was on offer for doing Floor spots. Dave was just trying to promote these Clubs and let his fans know he would be there and getting a share of the Door and or raffle take.

With out mentioning names (one Mudcater has used at least three) people who self promote and recommend themselves and or their Businesses should make it clear that they have they multiple Personalities, as Dave has now done, that they use to promote themselves. In one case this man not only promotes himself under one of his Mudcat Names but also slates what his ego he thinks is as a rival record distributor.

Honesty and the ability of being truthful are what we are all entitled too.
You have to have a very good memory to be a successful liar. Dave Kidman has apologised which is good. In this instance the people who blew the Whistle on him have done Dave a favour! For those who already worked out that he was doing a bit of self-promotion. Would find it hard to trust any words of wisdom from Dave in the future.

A person's private life has nothing to do with it! Well that is just not true especially if you put yourself in the Public Eye. It says a lot about a person's honesty but only if you know both sides. "Let he or she who is without sin cast the first stone".

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Joe Nicholson
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 12:10 PM

I have not been a Mudcat member for very long but I do find the practice of mudcat names rather odd. Although I do know and meet some Mudcaters quite regularly I must also meet some without knowing they are mudcaters.I wonder should we develop a funny hanshake like the masons?
Well done Dave and Best of Luck

Joe Nicholson

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Tim Leaning
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 10:02 AM

That was all a bit silly. I thought everyone knew them two blokes was the same one.

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: SINSULL
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 09:55 AM

I am thoroughly confused. And a bit sorry that David felt he had to deny the nasty accusations made against him. It is no one's business.

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 09:35 AM

Ah, yes Tyke - also known as Kantholdisgrog!

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Tyke
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 09:24 AM

Sorry George, I was it was a Greek! But his name was Popa Throwsupalot!

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 09:17 AM

Why can't people write their own copy? David's a sound critic and a damn fine singer to boot - seems fair enough to me whatever name he does it under. You get that all the time these days, like on The Apprentice when people tell us their strengths & weaknesses. No bad thing either - I'm sure we're all aware of our own as singers / musicians and how good we are in our own right or else in comparison to others, otherwise why would we bother? Times Modesty can be a curse, or lack of self-confidence, and bottle...


As for names - in the common law you can go by whatever name you like. I am twice Christened: once by my parents as Sean Breadin, then again as Sedayne by pure accident. On Mudcat I can at least choose to be Suibhne O' Piobaireachd, though I don't like signing in because I've had some bad PM experiences. It's an open forum, which would be better kept open, but that's just me.

S O'P

PS - I think Trolls are figments of on-line folklore & some particular repulsive name-calling that goes on around here...

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Tyke
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 09:11 AM

George I think it's a quote from that greek Chap Confusion who may or may not have lived in China!

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: keyofzed
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 09:03 AM

Well done David
See you at Morley tonight

http://www.morleyfolk.org/

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 08:55 AM

"only post to this Forum using my own name, since I am now of the opinion that there is no benefit to be gained from the use of a separate Mudcat "name", however fun or "good idea at the time" it might appear."

Another soul saved.... sigh .... so many, so little time ....

I don't care if people use not their own personal legal name, as long as they use a logged in member name (which can be changed at any time, and all your previous posts will carry over to the new id).

Of the 12 posts so far - 4 are 'guests' with allegedly constant 'guestnames' ie 'not members' who refuse for various reasons to not be members - BUT your 'handle can be stolen at any moment by a troll to discredit you.

After all the years i've been here, so far I've found less than half a dozen threads a year (all BS) for which purposes being 'anonymous' may be thought 'necessary'.

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 08:53 AM

"Tha niver git's owt far knowt and if tha dose tha must keep it far thee sen!"

At last - something that is Greek to me!

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Tyke
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 08:38 AM

Dave is obviously from the South so he maybe forgiven for not knowing about the advice given by Yorkshires Three Brass Monkeys. I will now pass on this wonderful piece of knowledge to David and to remind all that this advice should be taken on board.

The Monkey's are Called See All, Hear All and Say Nowt!

This piece of Yorkshire advice is indicated by the sitting position of the three wise Monkeys!

See all, drink all and pay knowt!
Tha niver git's owt far knowt and if tha dose tha must keep it far thee sen!

So I am not going to tell you that it is the artist themselves who write their own blurb and do not criticise anyone especially anyone who might give them a booking or review their album. ALEDGIDLY!

I'm also not going to tell you that publishing an inflammatory statement will be the one that gets the biggest reaction and keep people reading and commenting and selling News Papers and Magazines. ALEDGIDLY!

Dave is certainly an enthusiastic individual no doubt he was just attempting to put bums on seats. Nothing wrong with that but I think that were we would advise Dave who lives in Ilkley to wear a hat! When you have many Hat's you must make it clear which Hat you are wearing. Be it singer, poet, reviewer, MC, booking agent or Twitchier!

So all in all Dave's apology is to be appreciated and once you have read the offending thread and Dave's apology you can make up your own minds about it. Then remember the Three Wise Monkey's!

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: GUEST,John MacKenzie
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 08:35 AM

Quite often, the outcome of telling the truth about someone,is for them to tell lies about you.
Do what I do, ignore the detractors, they reveal their lack of brains, by their reactions to slights, real or imagined.
At least you came out Dave, well done. Don't hold your breath waiting for others to follow suit though! ;-)

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: RTim
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 08:34 AM

Well done David, and thank you for coming clean.

I have never really been a supporter of "Avatars" or "Mudcat Handles", even though I use one when posting, I have ALWAYS added my own name at the end of each post.
I think this is the best and most transparent method.

Tim Radford

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: GUEST,OldNicKilby
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 08:11 AM

Well done Dave you have the gravitas to rise above the menopausal venom. You know you have our full support and friendship. About time you made the effort to come to Second Saturday.
Keep on singing(b----r that came out as sinning)
Nic

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Acorn4
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 07:39 AM

I use my "handle", but sometimes put my name in the post as well if it would help to be identified on any particular occasion. I think quite a few of us know who each other are any way.

Glad the gigs went OK!

Dave Taylor

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: GUEST,MC Fat
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 06:56 AM

Well done Dave for 'coming out'

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Crane Driver
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 06:54 AM

Yes, thanks for clearing things up, Dave.

As someone who posted to the earlier thread, can I say I have no personal issues or agenda where Dave is concerned. I've always got on well with him when we've met at festivals, I know how deep his commitment to folk music is, I enjoy his singing and have always found him a fair and effective MC and reviewer. I am not interested in allegations about his or anyone else's private life. And obviously I have no issues with anyone using an obscure or 'amusing' handle here on Mudcat. I accept that some of 'MoorleyMan's' postings on the earlier thread were 'ill-chosen' and I'm happy to consider the whole matter closed.

Andrew

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 06:46 AM

Very happy to see this, David. As Silas said - it takes some cojones to do this.

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Linda Kelly
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 06:38 AM

David your commitment and support of Traditional Music cannot be questioned. Glad your joining those of us who ae happy to use our own name

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: Silas
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 06:15 AM

Well, that took a bit of courage and I applaud you for it.

Subject: RE: David Kidman: An Apology
From: GUEST,Banjiman
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 05:23 AM

Good for you David.

I'm glad you've cleared the air.

Paul

Subject: David Kidman: An Apology
From: DavidKidman
Date: 06 Apr 11 - 05:15 AM

Following the exchange of views in the recent thread (now closed) "David Kidman: April Gigs", I wish to apologise to Mudcatters for any confusion I may inadvertently have caused by my following the accepted practice of using a Mudcat "handle"/ID that was not my actual name.

OK, I come clean; it's a fair cop! Yet, I must point out, I've never actually denied my Mudcat ID at any time (in fact why should I? I've nothing to hide).
In the case of the thread referred to above, my posting as MoorleyMan started as nobbut an innocent (if maybe slightly tongue-in-cheek) publicity gambit to modestly drum up interest in a couple of local gigs.
However, a later response posting by MM was construed by one particular Catter as a pretence of being an unbiased observer of my own performance. That was never my intention, and if it came across that way, I can only put this down to ill-chosen words and/or an error of judgement on my part when rising over-hastily to correct a fact or two. That aside, from my perspective I felt the gig had gone well, and I merely echoed the general feel that came across in terms of the audience and response. (Any further, more specific evaluation of the performance of individual songs would necessarily be subjective of course…)
On learning of this misunderstanding, I admit that I panicked and signed myself up in my own name in an attempt to be open, clear the slate and hopefully at the same time stop the rot from spreading; I didn't get any further, for the thread had been closed. Hence the creation of this new thread.

Henceforth I shall follow the enlightened example of other Catters, and shall only post to this Forum using my own name, since I am now of the opinion that there is no benefit to be gained from the use of a separate Mudcat "name", however fun or "good idea at the time" it might appear.

I'd like to publicly thank those Catters who rose to my defence, those who have taken the time and trouble to get to know me and understand me. Good people one and all. Cheers!

As to the unpleasant personal accusations voiced by a certain "Guest, Daisy", however, which forced the closure of the thread: these seem to stem from some ancient-history malicious gossip that was doing the rounds many years ago, and are thus well past their sell-by date, yet I still find them deeply upsetting and hurtful.
Even if they were true – which they are NOT – one's personal life is exactly that, and such comments have absolutely no place on a respected public forum such as this.

Finally, I readily acknowledge that as far as singing goes, my approach and credo may be different from that of some others on the folk scene, and (inevitably) personal preference will always be a factor in reactions to it. But folk is a living and developing tradition, and no performer should be vilified for daring to be different if he/she retains his/her integrity and commitment. I maintain my belief in my role as a song-carrier. And as the saying goes, "I do what I do". While I'm always open to any constructive suggestions for improvement or development (as is any performer, surely – for everyone has to start somewhere, after all).
I will still be continuing with my booked gigs as advertised, therefore, beginning with the evening at Morley Folk Club on Wednesday 6th April 2011 in conjunction with the poet Jim Saville, "From Both Sides", which takes the form of an exploration of conflict in song and verse. Looking forward to seeing some of you Catters there.