Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: Geordie-Peorgie Date: 08 Mar 06 - 06:25 PM Whey ye bugga! Aah thowt aah wez the ownly porson in the country what cudden't stand the two-faced little oik Aah knaa loads of folkies and others whe've spent years and years in the armed forces and doon mines and in shipyards workin' damned hard te mek a livin' while him and his like prattle on aboot 'the workin' man' Billy Bragg waddent knaa a workin' man if he kicked his talentless skinny arse. And..... Aah divvent knaa whe thinks that Bragg is a 'FOLK' legend -Carthy is a legend, Swarbrick is a legend, Scan Tester, Billie Pigg, THEY wez legends!!! Billie Bragg?? Legend? My arse! He lives in a mansion on a cliff-top in Dorset And.....While we're on the subject! Has anybody heard a word of apology from Pete Coe about that piece of tat "We'll Have A May-Day Then" Aye pal!! Aall the may-days since 1997 are blighted - The culture secretary who thinks England dizzent have a culture - The Labour government who have ruined entertainment for the 'folk of this country at every turn, AND.... Tessa Bloody Jowell (Aye THAT culture secretary) got away with it AGAIN!!! They've aal got their fingers in a pot somewhere And..... And.... ....and John Prescott - Say nee mair!! |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 08 Mar 06 - 12:22 PM Well anyone who doesn't like Bragg MUST by default be a stalker, dissulsioned fan... bragg is crap. i mean, c'mon, listen to his 'music' he is utter crap and i don't liek folkies who persist on putting this man on a pedastal of folk, when frankly, there are far better artists down my local. He is a charlatan. Oh but i must not forget he is a hero, ex army and all, you know, one month and £175 and he was out of there. perhaps his fellow squaddies thought less of his music than he thought of them? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,Billy Braggs an alright bloke mate, innit ! Date: 08 Mar 06 - 11:35 AM oi guest mate you seem to be more concerned about Billy Bragg than is normal or healthy.. you a disillusioned fan..? was he to busy to sign your autograph book last time you saw him ? or are you a deranged stalker with a court order out on you to keep a safe distance from him ?? or what ??? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,Jon Date: 08 Mar 06 - 10:45 AM Well said, Shepherdlass, New-Labour = New-Tory. Our fundamental problem is that we do NOT live in a democracy. A democracy is where your vote counts. (See a dictionary). Our constituency system is set up to stifle any and all minor opinions and skews the result so much that only 2 parties have a chance of winning. And when those 2 parties are virtually indistinguishable......what's the point? And then they wonder why young people don't vote! Emigrate, I say....but where to....they're just as bad....oh b*gger! |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 08 Mar 06 - 08:46 AM Erm...ex army, oh yes...his parents paid £175.00 for him to leave after ONE MONTH! Oh yes, he's a hero. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,defender of the bragg Date: 08 Mar 06 - 08:45 AM He is ex army you freak and a talented singer, a better man than you will ever be! |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 08 Mar 06 - 08:35 AM are you any better and getting as much work & money as he is for it ? And there speaks the new capitalist face of Billy Bragg! Socialist Front Unite My Arse. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,defender of the Bragg Date: 08 Mar 06 - 07:07 AM Bragg is only human, he's got every right to be as much a two faced misguided cunt as the rest of us. ..as for the quality of his artistry, are you any better and getting as much work & money as he is for it ? ..thought not! |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 08 Mar 06 - 06:19 AM Bragg is a sell-out charlatan. Not to mention a very poor artist, if that is the right word. Why have folk lovers entertained thig guy for so long? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: shepherdlass Date: 03 May 05 - 01:37 PM The sad thing is that if Billy votes New Labour he won't be keeping out the Tories. New Labour is fundamentally Thatcherism with a few social justice bells and whistles to keep their once-core supporters quiet. Haven't noticed the restoration of that many REAL benefits for the many at the expense of the few: even the lovely Gordon's much-quoted Child Benefit increase didn't benefit parents on Income Support (the means testers just take it off at the other end). Sorry, this is turning back into a BS thread, but I worry that the thought of keeping a group of people from power because they bear a certain name means that we vote in people with near identical principles and a name we like more. Yours An ex-Labour stalwart |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 03 May 05 - 11:03 AM As well as building a huge dome over Britain to keep out the rain, whats next the abolishen of slavery??? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: Liz the Squeak Date: 03 May 05 - 10:23 AM The more I read here, the more I think I'll be voting Monster Raving Loony Party.... after all, their policies have formerly included all day opening for pubs and passports for pets - both policies that were approved and credit taken by other parties..... LTS |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: Terry K Date: 03 May 05 - 03:45 AM Sid, you're rambling again. You can't possibly support the current regime based on traditional stereotypes because they simply do not fit the traditional Labour stereotype. Support them by all means, but please base your support on something material. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: Ramblingsid Date: 02 May 05 - 04:01 PM To me the nub of this argument is very simple. I think that those that wish to occupy the moral high ground should stop and consider that, while they may be prosperous enough to be able to contemplate another tory government and all its cuts in public services, there are many in this country who are not and for whom the Tories winning the election on Thusday would be a personal disaster. I believe that when making their decision the electorate are entitled to consider the future of health education sure start etc etc are the issues of primary importance to us. Mistakes may or may not have been made by the Labour Government post 9/11 - history will tell. In the meantime I am more than happy to support a government whose values and policies are intended to be for the benefit of the many and the fight against a tory philosophy that is based upon privelige for the few. Thank you. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 02 May 05 - 08:47 AM That's correct Jim. And I would add, just because she is black and Jewish doesn't make her progressive or even liberal (she isn't, IMO), so why would progressives support her? Because she is black, Jewish, and female? I don't think so! As to "just guests" do you really want to go there gents? Many long time contributors here have always been "just guests" and claiming that they are guests because they don't want to stand by their opinions is ridiculous. People have many reasons for not taking cookies from internet chat forums, one very good one being the security of their computers. I'm also not such an egomaniac that I think my opinion is such hot shit that everyone needs to know it's mine. Others mileage may vary, of course. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: Jim McLean Date: 02 May 05 - 07:27 AM The thread is about Billy Bragg who is against the war in Irag but recently openly supported Oona King who is for the war. No special attack on Ms King except for her political beliefs |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,ray Date: 02 May 05 - 06:41 AM Sorry - not a member...yet. Just droppoed in on this thread. What is the particular problem with oona King? Just how many young black jewish women are there out there who have also made it to be an MP? How progressive is it to target her for some special vilification? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: Jim McLean Date: 02 May 05 - 06:13 AM Some people are frightened to associate themselves with and opinion, Eric. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: Dave Hanson Date: 02 May 05 - 05:10 AM I've just looked at this thread and another one with the same number of posts, why is this one nearly all GUEST posts and not members ? eric |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: Frankham Date: 01 May 05 - 02:53 PM I couldn't find the article. I saw another one that really made me upset on the same blog. Howard Dean says "we can't get out now." and that he hopes that Bush is successful in his mission over there. What!!!!? Re Bragg: I always had a reservation about him since Mermaid Avenue. I don't think Woody would have liked where Bragg is going and I'm not sure he would have liked what Bragg did to his tunes. Just an opinion by someone who knew Woody. Frank |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 01:51 PM and please answer why you dont like oona king..!!!!???? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,sick of pedantic cleverclogs Date: 01 May 05 - 01:47 PM people like 'you'.. you big silly revolutionary 'you'.. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 01:41 PM Sorry, but since I'm not a resident of yer local district, I don't think I'll be responsible for a Tory being elected there. Pretzel logic, that. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,sick of ......... Date: 01 May 05 - 01:36 PM "I don't believe there is any danger of the Tories winning, or of a Tory PM any time soon, so that bogeyman card won't play." me neither.. fingers crossed however, where i live, the local Lib MP is only a handfull of votes away from being displaced by a TORY !!! and labour wil probably never stand a chance of being elected.. so in my local constituency, the influence of people with misguided ideas like yours makes me very worried.. .. put bluntly [metaphorically speaking of course..] if 'you' cause me to be inflicted by life under a tory MP.. i might just probably cause you a bloody nose and bruised bollocks if we ever meet in person afterwards... so I WILL vote strategically against the tories.. not because i have any great love for blairs cowardly new labour or ginger bloated blokes ineffectual liberals BTW.. good song.. i've gigged with attilla.. he's a good pal of a mate of mine.. .. but can we please just concentrate in the short term on crushing the Tory party.. ..then over the next decade [or much more] we can fight to reclaim a better leftist 'party' from the best of whats left.. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 01:24 PM The Times They Are A-Changin Come gather round people wherever you advertise And admit that the sixties sells Chryslers and fries And accept it that money don't talk, it just lies If your bottom line is worth savin Then you better start skimmin all the anthems we've known For the stocks, they are exchangin Hokey Pokey You take the issues out, you put emotions in You take yourself out of the loop And you doctor up a spin You do some mumbo-jumbo and you turn your views around That's what it's all about |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 12:44 PM Another one for the sing-along (this IS a music thread after all) GUY FAWKES' TABLE Attila the Stockbroker I'm sitting at Guy Fawkes' table The day Parliament voted for war Though the mass of the people oppose it And it flouts international law I'm sitting at Guy Fawkes' table While American thugs flaunt their power Egged on by a sad little muppet And his craven and cowardly shower. Aneurin Bevan, your party is dead And the time for a new one is nigh Will the last person Left please turn out the lights? New Labour, we're saying goodbye. They won't be caught up in the carnage They'll be pontificating right here Their kids won't be Iraqi conscripts Moved down while they're shitting with fear No thought for the Kurds in the north zone When the Turks come to do as they will For they are American allies And they'll come with a licence to kill..... Aneurin Bevan, your party is dead And the time for a new one is nigh Will the last person Left please turn out the lights? New Labour, we're saying goodbye. I'm sitting at Guy Fawkes' table As Bush and his muppet connive And I'm filled with unspeakable anger And I'm thinking of 1605 One message, Dishonourable Members Who endorsed an illegal attack - No, I don't want to bomb you like Guy did But I'd love to send you to Iraq. Aneurin Bevan, your party is dead And the time for a new one is nigh Will the last person Left please turn out the lights? New Labour, we're saying goodbye. We need a new socialist party - But not the Judean People's Front Not another small sect, but a movement With the power to change and confront We need an electoral system Which gives every voter a voice 'Cos we're fed up with voting for traitors And we have the right to a choice! |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 12:33 PM I don't believe there is any danger of the Tories winning, or of a Tory PM any time soon, so that bogeyman card won't play. Also, did I mention that voting against what you hate and fear repeatedly while achieving the same result is rather counter-intuitve? And the Blair government progressive? Not even moderately. Conservative lite, yes. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 12:31 PM what is this .. sunday afternoon kareoke down the student union bar.. please just answer some effin questions JSC...!!!! |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 12:24 PM I'd like to dedicate this one to you, sick of, and all the people like you who are anti-warriors...except at election time. NO MORE WAR! "The socialist songbook" No more shall we fight their battles, No more shall we go to war, O,let the high and mighty slaughter one another. We will wage their wars no more. NO MORE WAR! No more shall we make munitions, No more guns and poison gas; O,let the high and mighty slaughter one another. No more for the working class. NO MORE WAR! No more shall we serve as targets, No more slay our fellow men. 0, let the high and mighty slaughter one another. We'll not go to war again. NO MORE WAR! No more shall we shout their slogans, No more: now that we're awake. O, let the high and mighty slaughter one another. Let them taste the hell they make. NO MORE WAR! |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 12:18 PM btw.. please explain why oona King is such a bad person.. and why your 'disgust' for a few individuals in new labour can justify your desire to replace a moderately 'progressive' Govt.. ..and consequently inflict a Tory prime minister on all of us in UK..?? thanks.. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 12:01 PM .. and for what its worth.. its a hatred that fuels an anger that politicizes for positive action.. .. not a hatred blind to other better options and strategies.. if and when we can make them possible and realisable.. certainly not blind adherence to paralysing inappropriate moralistic desertion from the real political power struggle that we're all [like it or not] neck deep in shit in.. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,sick of.. Date: 01 May 05 - 11:46 AM oh yes.. and what is that going to acheive after May the 5th if the tories get back in..!!!??? yes damn right I hate the tories.. hatred born from personal and community experience of their evil ideologies and economics.. ..not too keen on moralistically self indulgent people like you either |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 11:31 AM There is a hell of a lot more to political and community responsibility than hating the Tories. Too bad you are so blinded by your hatred you can't see your way out of hate to a place that transcends party loyalties. It's called doing what your conscience dictates...like standing up for what you believe in, instead of voting against what you hate and fear. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 11:27 AM GUEST,JSC "As I said, I just can't square his support of her with his previously stated political positions." ..and thats your problem trying to understand the 'consistency' of other peoples complicated dynamic evolving motivations, activism, and statements through the miasma of your own severly restricting moral principles.. ..but what 'disgusts' me about people like you is your selfish insistence on parading yourslf to be 'right' at the cost of your abnegation of political responsibility for our wider community.. and apparent total disregard for the potentialy tory promoting consequences of your hell bent wish to convince other leftist citizens to not use their vote against the tories.. sad.. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 11:22 AM This one also seems appropriate for the times: Children of the revolution Kirsty MacColl Children of the revolution coming out to play Bombers ripped the night apart and blew the school away Some live on the south side and they overlook the water Some live on the north side and they're looking at the border And those children of the revolution see the soldiers come Smiling at the widows as they take away the sons Children of the revolution shot down with a brand new gun They're dropping down like flies and in their eyes The images of war are in their eyes They've seen it all before and know your lies Won't keep their bellies full In love and war there are no rules Children of the revolution getting off the boat To face the ignorance and prejudice that keep this land afloat Children of the revolution make a brand new start Running through the rubble of a thousand broken hearts and in their eyes All promises are broken in their eyes The words that can't be spoken and your lies Don't keep their bellies full In love and war there are no rules But in their eyes Murder comes by sea and from the skies It's shiny and it's quick to take their lives And it's cruel in love and war there are no rules Children of the revolution coming out to play Someone sells a gun and someone blows them all away Children of the revolution sold out by the banks Who swap the green upon the dollars for the green upon the tanks Children of the revolution shot down by a brand new gun |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 10:30 AM Thanks Jim, for seconding my disgust over Bragg's support for Oona King. As I said, I just can't square his support of her with his previously stated political positions. Which is why I asked if he had sold out--supporting King is pretty difficult to justify as anything other than just that. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 10:25 AM Because I'm American? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,sick of being sick of... Date: 01 May 05 - 10:09 AM "Trotting out that lame old horse yet again? You must be very afraid of what it is I'm saying." nope.. just irritated... and dismayed.. and worried sick fools like you will stick me with a Tory MP for the forseeable future .. BTW GUEST,JSC why do you keep banging on about Bruce and the US election [and if I remember correctly, spell neighbourhood in a suspiciously American way... hmmmmmmmmmm...] ??? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 10:01 AM "I fearlessly predict Billy Bragg's fortune telling about the upcoming election will be just as way off as Bruce Springsteen's was about John Kerry and the Democrats in the US election..." well then you fearlessly mind boggled 5th columnist scab twat.. ..at least Billy Bragg and the left of centre unofficial anti-tory strategic voting alliance are tying to acheive something positive and constuctive and potentially progressive for UK society.. ... and sorry to need to ask the question again.. but what exactly are your plans for a realisable progresive future for our families, friends , communities , work conditions, etc.. ??? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: Jim McLean Date: 01 May 05 - 09:59 AM Billy Bragg's tactical voting may be justified but playing for Oona King can not. As far as the Lib Lab pact in Scotland is concerned, we have Liberals in power (Second Minister and other posts) although they came third in the election. If the Tories had a similar result in the UK election as Labour had in Scotland, we could see the Liberals hand in hand with the Tories in Westminster and hand in hand with Labour in Scotland! They have just voted to make possible top up fees to be introduced in Scotland .. but Billy Bragg is going to vote for them. I remember seeing him on Question Time a while ago. The question of Scottish Devolution was raised and Billy Bragg said '.. if they want it we should give them it'. Note the WE. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 09:55 AM Trotting out that lame old horse yet again? You must be very afraid of what it is I'm saying. Progressives in Britain can look to how effective the "vote strategically" tactic was in the last US election. The arguments for blindly supporting Labour and Lib Dems where it is "safe" to vote for them, is the exact same tactic taken by the right wing of the Democratic party in the US last year. Substitute "John Kerry" for "Tony Blair", "Democratic Party" for "Labour Party", and "Lib Dems" for "Ralph Nader" and/or "grassroots progressive Democrats" and you've got a perfect match. Something must change, because voting for the old war horses will change absolutely nothing. Whether you claim to be voting for Labour or against the Tories, the outcome is the same--same old shit. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,sick of mind boggled wankers Date: 01 May 05 - 09:42 AM so GUEST,JSC how much are the Tories paying you to persuade leftist inclined citizens not to vote.. ??? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 09:39 AM oops need to correct typing error.. ".. with the man campaigning on behalf of the war mongerers." of course that's not what he is supporting you naieve mind boggled irritating little twat.. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 09:39 AM I fearlessly predict Billy Bragg's fortune telling about the upcoming election will be just as way off as Bruce Springsteen's was about John Kerry and the Democrats in the US election... "For this to happen, however, it is crucial that Lib Dem supporters vote in unison with disillusioned Labour supporters as a progressive bloc – voting tactically to ensure that the Tories do not pick up any seats – voting together for left of centre government." Talk about unrealistic! |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,sick of mind boggled wankers Date: 01 May 05 - 09:35 AM boggles your mind does..!!??? then loosen the grip of severe tunnel vision on that poor little mind of yours.. and grow up and realise the complexity and apparent contradictions of reality.. ".. with the man campaigning on behalf of the war mongerers. of course that's not what he is supporting you naieve mind boggled irritating little twat.." ooohh .. that feels better... now to go swat some flies.. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,cheers BILLY, I owe you one Date: 01 May 05 - 09:28 AM "Two-for-one offer for Lib Dem voters in Dorset" http://www.billybragg.co.uk/news/news_story.php?id=264 " Much is at stake at this election. Anger with the Labour government over the Iraq war could result in Michael Howard running the country, says Billy. Labour could lose the election. Others call for a different outcome in which Labour get a 'bloody nose' winning with a vastly reduced majority. The trouble with that scenario is that most of the seats Labour loses will be to the Tories, creating a resurgent Conservative Party which believes that it will be further rewarded if it continues to stir up fear and prejudice. There is, however, a third outcome, in which the centre of gravity in British politics is shifted decisively to the left. If tactical voting causes the Tories to lose seats to the Lib Dems, then the Conservative Party would go into a tail-spin. The Lib Dems could emerge from this election with enough momentum to become the official opposition, forcing a Labour administration to tack to left of centre in order to deal with the perceived threat. The Lib Dems have already been able to influence Labour policy in this manner in the Scottish Parliament. For this to happen, however, it is crucial that Lib Dem supporters vote in unison with disillusioned Labour supporters as a progressive bloc – voting tactically to ensure that the Tories do not pick up any seats – voting together for left of centre government. " |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 09:28 AM Getting back to the anti-war Bragg song I posted above--I don't know how one reconciles writing a song like that, taking political action to oppose the war, and then campaigning for those who support the war. Boggles me mind, because I really thought Bragg, of all people, had more personal integrity than that. I just cannot square the actions of the man who was an ardent and passionate opponent of the war, with the man campaigning on behalf of the war mongerers. |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,the political troubador Date: 01 May 05 - 09:07 AM "Lads, we're in the music section discussing Billy Bragg, not the BS section discussing how we should vote, right?" errrrrrrmmm.. well .. yes.. and... no... I'm sure this is what Mr Bragg would want us to be doing as a proper response to his 'musical' art.... |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: GUEST,JSC Date: 01 May 05 - 08:11 AM Lads, we're in the music section discussing Billy Bragg, not the BS section discussing how we should vote, right? |
Subject: RE: The Selling Out of Billy Bragg??? From: The Shambles Date: 01 May 05 - 06:47 AM Islands and Oasis |
Share Thread: |
Subject: | Help |
From: | |
Preview Automatic Linebreaks Make a link ("blue clicky") |