BS: Special Jug Night

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Jul 01 - 12:27 PM

Well, as the saying goes, there's no such thing as a stranger, just someone you haven't been able to quarrel with yet.

That didn't look a crowded bar to me from Micca's photies. Everyone seems to have a seat available. A sedate session I'd have said from the pictures.

I read in the paper yesterday that they are going to scrap the WWF wrestling on the telly. Maybe it's time for the Jug to make a bid for a docu-soap slot to replace it.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: smallpiper
Date: 28 Jul 01 - 10:58 AM

Great Pictures Micca!

I felt that I was made really welcome at the Jug, now having re-read the threat I'm not so sure that I'll be coming back. Have your session keep it local and have another night for mudcatters.

I'll stick to my session at THe Hase in Hessle and still will welcome allcomers.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,april, jim , bill and sue
Date: 28 Jul 01 - 10:10 AM

Hi mike, we were not at the jug but do come often to listen and chat to friends. long live the jug and the music sessions, we hope that everyone will still come along to a very enjoyable night. And to see Harvey!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Cretinous Yahoo
Date: 28 Jul 01 - 09:46 AM

No wonder you lost the war, you dont even know how to conduct a good knock down drag out fight. In yankee bars, we dont throw coins, we throw punches! (sometimes, bullets) You guys are just not trying.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: kendall
Date: 28 Jul 01 - 09:42 AM

I was thinking of visiting the Jug while I'm over there, but, now, I dont know. I dont go to American bars because of the many cases of testosterone poisoning. Did you ever see that button that says INSTANT ASSHOLE, JUST ADD ALCOHOL ?? Or, was this a very rare night? 11 yeas ago, I did a tour of the pubs and folk clubs in Scotland, and, was very pleased to see that people there were considerate and had not forgotten their manners. Is that how it usually is in England?

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Dave Wynn
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 09:51 PM

Possibly not relevant.

I help to run a folk club in Swinton , Lancashire....We have been running 19 years ....same pub same night. Last week we were hijacked by a crowd of strangers (about 12 of them ) who haven't been before. They were not in the same party , just co-incidence. One insisted on singing a more cabaret than folk song during the singers session.

Some of them talked during performers singing and they were not aware (even though notices are posted) of usual FC etiquette.

At half time (we have a raffle and a break) my daughters partner came in to the pub who I see only rarely because they live 200 miles away. So I handed the running over to Dave T Gnome and stood with Andrew in the bar.

The regulars came out of the club at 1130 or so and earholed me with what a great night it had been and how much the "incomers" had provided in song and laughter and chat and "why did I miss out on it all".

Smell the coffee Mike....we are not involved in an exclusive club , where only the players (and only good players at that) are welcomed and then only if they play.....and only if they have been attending regularly for the last decade...and don't talk....

I have only been once to the jug (last years gathering) so I have no right to comment on the regular session , but at our club we welcome all and sundry , all the time , regardless of what any individual feels.....It's not an individual thing..Thats why we gather each Monday as a group.

Finally....I hope anything I have said is taken in the spirit of open discussion.

Spot.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 08:09 PM

Obviously not the last word...

Mike, for the conspiracy theory to hold true, Bill would have had to have deliberately got the Sircam thingy, a) to get me up there and b) to persuade him to start this thread as he didn't want to risk infecting and of his email contacts.

From my side, I am very dissapointed to see something that I still feel was caused by other circumstances and involved me trying to help a FRIEND out (admittedly trying to get some good music along the line) turned into this.

I repeat that I sympathise with some of your concerns but I feel that matters have been blown out of all proportion.

Jon

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Noreen
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 07:40 PM

There is no conspiracy, Mike, nor was the session hijacked on Wednesday, and since you weren't there for most of it, I can't see how you can complain about what happened when you weren't there. Can't you see that several other people could have a different point of view from yours about this session?I haven't slated you, but tried to understand your concerns and be reasonable. Being constantly ignored is also a depressing experience. Several people have tried to reason with you in this thread, but you have ignored points made or taken bits for your own ends. That doesn't encourage me to keep trying...

Thanks for the pictures, Micca- really good, happy one of Mrs Cobble, Patrish and Catrin.

Noreen

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: The Shambles
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 06:49 PM

"I have to say that as a general principle, I think it unwise risk turning an established session into a "Mudcat event".

Not saying that this night was an attempt to do this but should not the good common sense above, from one who was present deserve to be the final (public) word on this?

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Mike Cahill
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 06:43 PM

Jon having read the post I made that contained the quote from you I Think you were right, and I had got you out of context, sorry. My biggest regret about Wednesday is that I didn't get a chance to speak to you, your posts have been to the point, and reasonable. One of the things that has surprised me through this thread is that although several people including myself have suggested a separate mudcat night this has never been followed up even though people have found time to comment about me mis-spelling SYD, and JON. Now if I was a conspiracy theorist I would be imagining lots of E-mails flying around with "Don't get involved with the separate night for mudcat thread" could this be because some people feel that they already have a mudcat night on Wednesdays? It's strange that all this blew up at the start of Chris' two week holiday in Scotland (Chris for those who don't know the set-up at the jug usually leads the sessions, and is a consistent attendee), or am I just Paranoid? It would hardly be a mudcat mom's apple pie Thing to do now would it? Moving in on an existing session, hardly an honourable thing to do.. There is a separate thread running at the moment "When a session gets Hijacked". Some of you might be interested in giving it a look. Being constantly slated is a depressing experience and at times I have felt like not bothering to keep replying to this thread, the standard of some of the postings is not exactly stimulating, and I'm not all that proud of some of the things I've said in the heat of the moment. but then a couple of people one of whom has stopped going recently because of the changes have taken the trouble to phone me and give me support. If the session at the jug continues, I'll be there (unless of course I've been barred)

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Micca
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 11:04 AM

Pictures from the above mentioned Special Night at the Jug are viewable here.. Click here
I have included the time stamp from my camera on some of them (and from others I havent included) from which it can clearly be seen that throughout the evening there was space and seating available for any musicians to join that might have wished to. I have always felt very welcome at the Jug by both existing and new friends whether mudcatters or not, Otherwise why would I bother to travel from London for an overnight stop?? to Gossip?, can do that on the Internet, without leaving home ,thank you...The reason is simple, to hear friends play their music, and to sing with them ( I love to sing) and if the talk gets in the way of the music, the "talkers" went(or were sent) in the other bar this has been MY experience (at the Jug as well as elsewhere) any way...
My Thanks to all who made me feel welcome... Especially to Bill and his wife Lorna for their hospitality,
and to those xenphobes who think so parochially... well, I think you represent the antithesis of everything the Mudcat represents, which is striving (very sucessfully) to bring people with skills and interests in a wide range of Folk and Roots Music , together to play, sing, talk, and interact, and thus to promote a better understanding of Life and OUR Music... and I am sorry if my visit offended you , but If the choice is offending you or enjoying visiting the Jug and friends....

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 08:22 AM

In his initial thread Bill made it clear he was posting because his e-mail was having problems.It didn't read to me like a general invitation, just alerting the regulars to the two visitors. As a non-Jugger it is none of my business, but I would respectfully suggest that as all parties (and the guests) have now given their views, any remaining issues could be sorted out face to face over a pint of Syd's (what I'm told is splendid) ale?
Even a folk club usually welcomes visitors, how a less formal gathering can remain exclusive is unclear,as has been said. I'll shut up now and hope common sense prevails, it has always sounded like a venue to be encouraged.
RtS (...but then, what do I know?)

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 07:40 AM

Someone earlier on suggested that there be another night for mudcat but you lot chose to ignore it and didn't read what someone else had sad

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 06:00 AM

Well we will have to agree to disagree on your use of my quote to indicate an example of "missing the plot". In simpler English, I went to the Jug hoping for a session, didn't find much of a session for reasons given but at least enjoyed the company. This is rather different to me thinking that the Jug is or should be a "social event" (which I take to mean a place for lots of chat as a session is in fact a social event - just the focus in a session is music).

Although it does appear that the bulk of the trouble in the Jug on Wednesday was caused by a particular group of locals, I have to say that as a general principle, I think it unwise risk turning an established session into a "Mudcat event".

I would take any Mudcatter visiting Norfolk to any of the events I go to localy and they would be made welcome but I would not go as far as trying to enourage numbers of people from further away to meet up there on a regular basis and I feel I would risk making myself unpopular if I did. I also recognise LTS's comments on needing new faces - it is essential for the health of a session - it's just a question of balance and in some cases a little control (e.g. the Norwich session I go to is strictly Irish instrumental and while I enjoy other things, I would hate to see the basic nature of the session changed - besides that, Ken and Maria would probably kill me, there are other nights for other events...) , or at least I think so.

Jon

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Jardin
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 04:14 AM

Well, you UK Mudcatters are having a little problem. I suggest you move to another bar and don't tell Mike the miserable where you are going. If I ever came across, I think I would give the Jug a miss. We are supposed to be all grown up and not waste time squabbling . Get back to your Music.

PS I met someone the other day who met Bill on his recent trip - said he was quiet and unassuming - not like the egocentric god that you describe Mike . Are you sure you are talking aboout the same man? Don't you think a public apology to Bill is in order. Remember your manners.

Jardin

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 03:54 AM

I think you are right sarah BG

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Sorcha
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 03:44 AM

I think he meant Syd too, instead of Sid.......

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 03:38 AM

Mile-Maybe a seperate mudcat would be a good idea,BTW I think you meant Jon!

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Mike Cahill
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 03:27 AM

John I'm sorry you think that your statement was taken out of context, having re-read your post I think that the sentence I used stands on it's own as a complete statement, if anything I could have clipped the few words at the front, Your contribution is welcomed, what you have said has been reasonable, and honest, and you told it as you saw it. Please read my previous posting "Dear Dr. Mudcat", which was started a week or so before this "spat" erupted. To be honest it was aimed at some of the other mudcatters (I class myself as one) who come to the Jug on a Wednesday's it was felt, (and not just by me), Bill endorsed my views, that the balance had swung too far from a music session to a talking group. Regular musicians had started to drop off, forced out by not being able to get a seat, and by not being able to hear what they and others were playing. Some of the newer people had instruments with them, but often as a prop. Mudcat is by definition a talking shop, it owes it's existence to the forum. If it was just a Tune Database it would probably get 100 hit's a day world wide. I was hoping that some of the worst offenders might read the thread, and moderate the volume of their chatter. To see within days that Bill was advertising Nationally, and internationally in a place that would only be seen by a group of people that we had already identified as causing a problem beggared belief. No attempt had been made to contact any local musicians, (as far as I'm aware) it was just compounding the problem. I'm not suggesting that people sit in silence for the entire evening, That posting of Bill's was unreasonable, and unfair to the other users of the jug, who are not represented here if they don't have a computer. We were lucky that only 15 or so mudcatters did turn up, There could have been many more, and that would have buggered up any chance of a session. I'm sorry that you and other musicians have been caught up in this, and hope that they will come to the jug in future, but if you want to turn the session into a chat room with background music then think again. As I've said repeatedly if people want to sit and chat, start a Mudcat night on a different night, Sid would love that. It doesn't have to be either / or.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 27 Jul 01 - 01:45 AM

Hi Bill, this may not be the place for it, but my Mudcat PM thing is down. Just passing on a message. Johnny Collins says "hello".

Cheers

Rick

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: ericsymonds
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 08:15 PM

I never experienced any friction, musical or otherwise, in the Jug,and I am sorry to read that it should occur,ever!

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: harpgirl
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 07:38 PM

...well, I'm no longer saying anything about sessions here in Florida or anywhere else, but Jon....have you left yet or are you already back or what? What's up with that? Are you feeling better???Your admirer who refused to say goodbye....hg

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Sorcha
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 06:57 PM

I wish.........sob sob sob. (Mike would probably kick me out,(joking, ok). Fare from NY or East Coast to London is cheap. Fare from Denver to NY is NOT!! And then there is poor Maggie--she is not going in the baggage hold!

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Noreen
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 06:53 PM

When are you coming to the Jug, Sorcha? :0)

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Jeri
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 06:52 PM

That's it. Mike has an idea of what it should be which is different from what it is or what others think it should be.

Our sessions here vary quite a bit from week to week. Sometimes there's an awful lot of socialising, and other times it's straight music. Sometimes, folks (almost always regulars) are rude and talk while others sing, other times there can be complete silence during a song. We often have new musicians show up, and they're welcomed. I've never heard one complaint about "outsiders." They often contribute new songs and tunes, and the variety kicks up the energy level.

Mike, it seems like you're saying no one should be allowed to invite friends to this session - have I got that right? Maybe you'd be better off in an "invitation only" session, because it sure sounds like your the only person who doesn't want anyone new showing up at the Jug.

You get too grumpy about things, you miss some good music. Been there, done that, and still do it occasionally!

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 06:49 PM

Mike, if you are going to quote me, at least quote me in context. I was one of very few who did express some sympathy for your view point and had made it clear enough that my aim was to get to a SESSION while on what was in a sense a business trip.

I fear that it is you, not me, who has lost the plot by being so caught up in your own bitching that you can't even comprehend what others are saying.

Jon

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Sorcha
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 06:35 PM

Apology accepted, but I wish you would learn to spell my name--it is Sorcha, not Scorcha. Pronounced Sork-(h)ah. But I also answer to Sor-sha. Sorry for my snotty little comment too.

"It is not a social event it is a music session." Excuse me? I really thought that a session was a social event. Mine are..........Your idea of a session sounds more like a rehearsal to me. Someplace where NOTHING goes on except tunes. Glad I don't go to what Mike considers sessions.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Noreen
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 06:30 PM

So do you not make friends with people with whom you play in a session, Mike? Do you not exchange the occasional pleasantry, particularly with someone you've not seen for a while? Or would you choose to, as it sounds here, sit and play tunes robotically alongside others who do the same thing? I've never been to a session like that, and can't imagine it being any fun.

Or do you have a problem with the personnel, which also seems possible from what you have said?

It is the session that we have been invited to, and I can't really see your problem, sorry, though I have tried.

Noreen

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Mike Cahill
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 05:26 PM

sorry I forgot to put my name to that last posting

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 05:25 PM

"Anyway, sorry to sound miserable. I take the night for what it was - mostly a meeting of friends and very enjoyable for that reason."

"Well, Bill was inviting musicians, so presumably that would be a whole lot different from you inviting boaters, etc. And, he wasn't inviting just any, he was inviting Mudcatters,"

"I go on a Wednesday because I enjoy the session, enjoy the crack and catch up on the gossip, including chewing out work problems with others a lot of the time - it's great for support."

"If all you want to do is play music then go join a band. If you want to play music with no audience then join the Ukelele Orchestra of G Britain"

Just a few quotes, You really are missing the plot, It is not a social event it is a music session. If you want a mudcat social evening then start one as someone who has been a regular contributor to mudcat for 3 or 4 years I would support it, But on a different night or at a different venue, get off the coat tails of the session

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Noreen
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 04:53 PM

Your loss, anonymous GUEST.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 04:39 PM

Here I've been wishing I could find a way to get myself to The Jug; not so sure now.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Noreen
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 03:58 PM

Nice one, Cobble... :0)

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Noreen
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 03:54 PM

Firstly, thanks all for making me so welcome last night. It was a lovely night, playing, singing and chatting with friends new and old. Well worth the (supposed) hour and a half's drive each way for a two hour session, which was not achieved last night due to a 40 min holdup on the motorway.

Mike, sorry that you have a problem with the way your session is going, but I think that is a separate issue from the problem you seem to have with Bill in particular, and mudcatters in general. Bill in no way hogged the session, or treated the gathering as his 'fan club'- the very idea to me is laughable. Bill took a back seat, being quietly welcoming and friendly as ever.

I'm sorry you felt you had to leave early, Mike, as I'm sure you would have enjoyed the music and the atmosphere later. It would be a hard-hearted person indeed who would not have felt the friendliness and warmth there, as mentioned by others above.

You complain about strangers who came to talk, not play or listen (who appear to have been locals, and not mudcatters), then defend the behaviour of people who were noisily using the one armed bandit while totally disregarding the singing going in in the same very small room. (It was me singing and I understand someone getting upset by such behaviour. The throwing of coins across a crowded bar to draw attention to the fact that they were being inconsiderate was, however, not such a good idea...) The mudcatters present were without exception singers, players or attentive listeners, surely exactly who you want to attract to any session?

Much more I could say, but those were the main points I wanted to address. If you are a member, Mike, please feel free to PM me to discuss any of this. Hope to meet you at some stage, either at the Jug or at another Gathering.

And thanks agian, all, for another wonderful Jug evening.

Noreen

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Cobble
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 03:43 PM

On the lighter side of last night, I came home 5p up from the coin thrower.

Cobble.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Banjo-Flower
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 03:18 PM

as an occasional visitor from further away i think that most of the problem last night was

caused by one individual who wanted to dominate every single tune that was started and when he was't playing throwing a coin viciously when a quiet diplomatic word produced the required result much more effectively also Mike i don't know what your problem is with Bill but i for one certainly do'nt worship at his altar because as the third banjo player there last night the only difference between Bill,Jon Freeman and myself was that we knew different tunes however if you do'nt want me to turn up again just say the word and you wo'nt see me again as there are other sessions around where visitors are welcome

Gerry

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Tig
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 02:48 PM

It's OK for Mike to go round calling the Jug HIS local, but where is he on the other nights of the week? He doesn't seem to be in very often.

I go on a Wednesday because I enjoy the session, enjoy the crack and catch up on the gossip, including chewing out work problems with others a lot of the time - it's great for support. Sometimes I don't bother getting my bodhran out and playing, sometimes I do, it just depends on how I feel. I thought that was what Mudcat was all about!!!!!

As far as I could see it would have been a fairly quiet night without some of our friends from further away dropping in. The Ducks, Chris and Jellybean, Eric and a fair few others were all away - possibly dropping in on other sessions. If I turn up on an 'ordinary' Wednesday in the middle of winter there's often more 'Strangers' in the place AND I can't get a seat, which I could last night when I turned up at about 8.45pm.

Stop being mardy Mike, it's NOT worth it and it will only cause bad feelings without any real cause.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: selby
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 02:00 PM

I wonder when you openly castigate the melodeon that you understand how the Jug session started.It was born out of a Plough stots side that practised on a Wednesday night in Haddlesy if my memory serves me correctly there where 3 meledeons 2 fiddles and 1 accordian, tunes where played and when the tunes dried up a sing song ensued that produced a song book so that everyone could join in anyone that was in at the time had songbook thrust into their hands and where encouraged to join in , I think Mrs Duck, Mouldy, Windy b or Jellybean can confirm this and correct my memory if I am wrong. I am glad that we did not go with our 10 year old MELODEON player last night and some of the anger that is been targeted at box players makes us as a family wonder should we go elsewhere. I agree with what Mike was saying at the begining that wednesday night has always been a local musician session and if we on mudcat would like to meet and have a natter should maybe look at another night. As for session etiquete you always get different tunes being played at different ends of the room due to the dynamics that is a problem of the room and no individual player.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: bill\sables
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 12:04 PM

John, Smallpiper, It was good to meet you last night, I enjoyed your piping very much. Next time you come why not put your Highland war pipes in the car in case there are any more loud agressive accordion players there, most of us can't compete volume wise with him.
Bill

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: smallpiper
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 11:39 AM

Do I detect some bad feeling? Knock it on the head before it becomes so silly that it really does kill the session, which, apart from the accordian player not having a volume control and throwing things at people, I enjoyed. I found the people to be wonderfully friendly and welcoming and would love to come back again - possibly making it a regular thing, who knows?

Next session at the Hase in Hessle is on Tuesday all and I mean all are welcome - (its a bigger pub).

Nice to have met you all

John

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 10:39 AM

Total side track and totaly selfish incedentals:

For me, I saw real friendships last night - people genuinely pleased to meet others - probably done me a lot of good in terms of my feelings towards Mudcat lately.

I got to have a short go on a Docherty madola - all I can say is try one if you get the chance - they really are top class instruments!

Even with my comments about the music, there were highspots, Catrin singing with Noreen in harmony (doubt many would have heard Noreen's harmony - she sang it very quietly), Smallpiper, what I managed to hear of nikak on the fiddle sounded great... could continue for a while and mention others...

Jon

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: bill\sables
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 09:22 AM

When Jon Freeman and I arrived at the Jug last night at approx 8-45 we found seats straight away, Mike I did notice you were sitting outside at the time. However most of the people were regular patrons of the Jug with the exception of Micca and an Accordion player who has been there a few times. This accordion player is not a member or guest on mudcat and my posting regarding the "Invitation to the World" which Mike refers to could not have attracted him as he does not even own a computer. He did, though, bring his wife and another couple of adults and two kids with him so taking up 5 non musical seats. It was also him who caused the very slight problem regarding the fruit machine, this was so slight I would think only about 4 or 5 people even noticed it. Later in the evening a new musician arrived (Smallpiper) who contributed very well to the nights music with his border pipes. Even later Noreen and Catrin, who have been to the Jug a few times before, arrived and also found seats I am sorry thet you felt you needed to leave early Mike, if you had stayed I am sure you would have had and contributed to a fine night of music and song.
Bill

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Patrish
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 09:18 AM

Hi Mike, Yes I am Patricia
I do care about what happens at the Jug, as I said before - I really look forward to Wednesdays. I love the sessions the songs and the people. If it was overcrowded every week then it would be a real problem. Last night was crowded and a bit noisy at times.
The chap who threw money at the people on the bandit missed them and hit my mate Alan on the head. He was also starting to play tunes while someone else was playing. I feel a bit ashamed that I did not do something about it at the time.
But my overall feelings about last night are that I had a good night - I was so pleased to see everyone.
Mike, I don't think there will be many, if any repeats of last night.
I echo what Jon says - please talk to Bill
Patrish

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 08:50 AM

Mike, I've just re-read the thread. Why don't you take a deep breath and have a chat with Bill in private?

As for me, I wasn't up there for a meeting of people, I was up there because Bill had Sircam virus, problems with a scanner and printer and a couple of other computer problems. He emailed me asking if there was anyway I could help and I agreed, naturally choosing Wednesday because I love sessions.

The night didn't turn out anything like I had expected it to (nor did the night before when Bill was in the Norwich session - it was the worst Tuesday night I've been to with key people missing, some new people there...) - but I managed to make something of the night and came home happy.

I guess its harder when you are there every week but really and honestly, I can't help feeling that you are blowing something that, at least from my side, was caused entirely by other circumstances out of all proportion.

Jon

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Mike Cahill
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 08:09 AM

I take comfort from the fact that the attacks on me come from people who don't know me (thank you for the virus whoever, my anti- virus caught it). Patricia is the only person I actually know who has commented, although I might be wrong that is the problem with nicknames. None of the regular Musicians from the jug (bar Patricia) have commented about the place being taken over. The man wanting to use the bandit, who had stuff thrown at him might have something to say isn't he one of the syd's customers? When winter comes, the new school term starts, or it just seems a bit far to travel on a cold dark night some of the new faces from far away who were there last night might not feel like coming to the Jug. If the locals have all been driven away 'cos there isn't space for them what will happen to Syd's takings then, what will happen to the session? Who will care? I will! Will you? I apologise to the person known as Scorcha; the wisecrack I made was un- called for.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 07:35 AM

Oh well, we arrived home safely. The Jug was a great pub and it was good to meet some new people and some that I hadn't seen for some time.

Mike does have (at least in part) my sympathy. The night sort of reminded me of a Friday night in the Bangor Festival where old faces meet up for the first time in a year - lots of musicians but lots of chat with everyone catching up with their hello's etc - the music rarely got going there until nearly closing time because of that but we had all Saturday and Sunday to carry on playing - the Jug jut has the Wedsnesday night.

I don't know whether it was just me and whether my problem was caused by the noise levels but when the music started, it rarely, if ever felt, like a session and there were times, I felt as if I was more in a competition with 2 accordian players than in a session.

Anyway, sorry to sound miserable. I take the night for what it was - mostly a meeting of friends and very enjoyable for that reason. For me though, if I get up that way again (distance being the problem), I will hope to be sneaking in on a good session.

Jon

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Skipjack K8
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 07:21 AM

Glad to confirm your inferiority complex, Infidel. This truth doesn't hurt much.

Skipjack

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Les from Hull
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 07:02 AM

I think you'll find it's arseholes!

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 06:28 AM

I always thought you UK catters were a self righteous set of assholes, ha ha, now you have proved it.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Jim McDonald
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 04:30 AM

I've not been to the Jug, and am not likely to go. This is not because of the recent spat between Bill and Mike, but because the logistics are too complicated. Everything I have heard about the place and the people and the landlord make the place sound too good to be true. So it is too good to be true.
Mike you will end up cutting off your nose to spite your face - silly man.
Patrish , live in the real world, people will not forget this bad feeling, Mike has blown it for you all by making this a public thing. I feel most sorry for the bar owner - he is the real innocent in this.
Jim McDonald