BS: Senate Seat for Sale

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 04:10 PM

Reform has come to mean "this time we promise not to get caught"

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Rapparee
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 04:01 PM

First of all, where I in Fitzgerald's place I'd do exactly what he did: arrest Roddy and try to stop him from selling a seat in the Senate or worse, taking it himself. This isn't politics, it's good law enforcement.

Secondly, Roddy started out as a reform candidate following the Ryan governorship and God knows, Illinois needed reform after that! He did okay for the first couple of years and then power corrupted.

Thirdly, trying to link Obama to Roddy's sins is kinda like linking me to the Director of the University library: I know her, we work together, and that's about it. People working in a job tend to know others working at their same level; it in no way means that they are somehow connected in unsavory matters.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: GUEST,Congressional staffer
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 03:55 PM

One thing to take away from all this...

Government is Government but the Banks OWN it all.
Don't F around with the Bank of America or you bleeping bleeps are bleeped.

In other words; Don't give the public a view of organized legitimate dissent against the Banks, or the Banks will organize against you.

In the real world the rhetoric that we have heard, bleeped to death, is not unusual. What would be unusual is if money, instead of "favors" were actually exchanged for the Senate seat.
There is no claim or proof that any money or promises were made for the seat.

When Presidents are mere pawns to owners of Big Banks, a Govenor is just dust in the wind.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 03:46 PM

" I guess that no one else finds it the slight bit curious that this guy has been under investigation for, what, 4 years and it's only stuff that he's done very recently that brought charges against him??? "

Obama helped push for an ethics reform bill in Illinois (yes, he was paying some attention to his home state during the campaign)which was to put curbs on campaign contributions.   The Gov., seeing that his funds would dry up, started to push for "donations" before the reforms took effect. People started talking, the feds started investigating, and guess what they found!

Subject: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Genie
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 03:37 PM

Yeah, Bobert, I find the timing rather convenient too. And I too wonder if Republicans are being investigated as diligently as Democrats are (though I think Fitzgerald himself is pretty non-partisan).   The Dems in Congress, though, seemingly are still sticking to the "let's move on, let's "work across the aisle," and let's not get bogged down with distractions like investigating Republican corruption" strategy. Problem is, when your side takes that tack and the other side's perpetually out for blood, your side's corrupt politics either get exposed more often or get more media attention or both.

In this case, though, I think the Democrats may have pushed as hard as the Republicans for Blagojevich to be indicted now.   I don't think they wanted him to appoint a tainted Democratic senator and then later have both be exposed.   They want the Senate seat but they don't want that Senate appointee to be exposed as corrupt after s/he has been seated.

I also think that the Democrats are a lot like cats when it comes to being herded. Today's Republican Party seems to have a stronger hold on the reins of their members than the Democratic Party has on theirs. The Republicans/neocons/"conservatives" also have a huge, powerful echo chamber in the corporate media consortium.   So when Republicans are exposed as corrupt - even indicted, convicted, etc. - there seem to be all sorts of voices on radio and TV and within the party coming to their defense.   Ted Stevens was almost re-elected to the Senate despite being convicted of corruption. William Jefferson was soundly defeated for re-election to the House after being indicted for that money found in his freezer - and that House seat hasn't been won by a Republican in a long time, until now.
The liberal and progressive talk shows are being as tough on Blagojevich as they ever were on Stevens or Libby or Abramhoff (sp?), etc.   And I don't hear other Democratic politicians condoning Blagojevich's actions or supporting him. They want him out.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 03:35 PM

When I read the title, I mistook it for a Canadian Senate seat (we have 14 or so vacant). I thought, now that's a good idea, sell it on EBay. It could be an alternative political party funding route.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Bobert
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 02:53 PM

I guess that no one else finds it the slight bit curious that this guy has been under investigation for, what, 4 years and it's only stuff that he's done very recently that brought charges against him???

I'd be willing to bet that every Democratic governor has also been under investigation for the last 4 years...

Yeah, the Repubs hate to lose and they don't do it very well... This was their early Christmas present but I don't think they are finished with the mischief yet...

I mean, lets get real... This is exactly what they did with Bill Clinton, too... Investigate, invetsigate and investigate and if it weren't for some boneheaded things on his part the Repubs would have come up empty...

With all the real crime that is out there I find it incrdulous that taxpayers money was being spent month and month after month after month adding up to well over 3 years of investigating without someone sayin', "Hey, ain't nuthin' here" and shut doen the investigation...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Genie
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 02:26 PM

Even if Obama helped advise and plan Blagojevich's gubernatorial campaign strategy -- which I don't think would be unusual, as members of the Illinois Democratic party -- that would in no way suggest that Obama was party to any of Blagojevich's corrupt actions as governor (or even as a candidate).

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: pdq
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 02:21 PM

Tuesday, December 09, 2008

...Ryan Lizza's piece in the New Yorker:

That year, (Obama) gained his first high-level experience in a statewide campaign when he advised the victorious gubernatorial candidate Rod Blagojevich, another politician with a funny name and a message of reform. Rahm Emanuel, a congressman from Chicago and a friend of Obama's, told me that he, Obama, David Wilhelm, who was Blagojevich's campaign co-chair, and another Blagojevich aide were the top strategists of Blagojevich's victory. He and Obama "participated in a small group that met weekly when Rod was running for governor," Emanuel said. "We basically laid out the general election, Barack and I and these two." A spokesman for Blagojevich confirmed Emanuel's account, although David Wilhelm, who now works for Obama, said that Emanuel had overstated Obama's role. "There was an advisory council that was inclusive of Rahm and Barack but not limited to them," Wilhelm said, and he disputed the notion that Obama was "an architect or one of the principal strategists."

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Rapparee
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 01:20 PM

Unless Obama is quite, quite stupid -- and he's not -- there is nothing to link him to this. The "Senate Candidate 1" is presumed to be someone Obama appointed to another office -- it looks to me like Roddy boy is wriggling like mad in this and can't get free.

Hubris will do that to you.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: JedMarum
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 01:05 PM

It's incredible to me that the news IS trying to link it to Obama! They just want headlines that'll sell. No wonder their readership is dropping like flies! Obama is on top of the world right now. Anyone with a lick of brain could see he wouldn't have touched this under any circumstances - didn't have anything to gain from doing so, and didn't have any need to do so - even if he was inclined to do that sort of thing (and there's nothing in his past to say he is inclined to such things).

I didn't vote for Obama but any fool can see he has no hand in this. It makes me angry that every time some idiot does something outrageous we have a chorus of media pundits trying to prove it is a systemic problem!

Blagojevich is bad apple. He may have infected a few others around him, but this is NOT the way all politicians work - and it's a damn good thing the prick got caught.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 12:32 PM

As I understand it, the problem with this guy Blagojevich is that he too seems to have "said and did what he believed". Not a wise thing to do in the circumstances.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Maryrrf
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 10:31 AM

I knew corruption existed but I was staggered by the brazeness of this one. What an arrogant SOB.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Riginslinger
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 10:01 AM

Fox News is desperately trying to link it all to Obama.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Bobert
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 08:33 AM

Competetive bid is ther operative term here, T...

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: SINSULL
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 08:17 AM

I spent the night remembering Watergate - feel better now. Politicians have always been pigs. Except Ed Koch, the NYC mayor. He always said and did what he believed. It was a riot to watch.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Teribus
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 07:50 AM

"...let me throw this out... Had the FBI, the IRS and the US Justice Department investigated Dick Cheney over the awarding of contracts to Halliburton then the indictments would sound just about the same, including all the bleepin' bleeps..." - Bobert.

I would throw that out too Bobert, as would "the FBI, the IRS and the US Justice Department". Much as though you would like to think that Dick Cheney awarded contracts to Halliburton - He, Dick Cheney did not.

Oh Bobert, while you're about it, on the awarding of contracts to Halliburton please tell us all if what is written below is true:

- In 1998 during the Clinton Administrations second term, Halliburton were awarded a five year Frame Agreement Service Contract with the Pentagon.

- That contract was awarded as the result of a "Competitive Tender" process.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 05:27 AM

Genie -

Apologies if I misread your intent. The slight ambiguity is one reason I didn't cite by post date/time back to your post. I intended to make my comment sufficiently vague to not point specifically to your post, but apparently I was insufficiently vague if it seemed that I did.

Of course we should all have lots of faith in orders from a court that meets in secret, whose members identities are secret, whose orders and deliberations/conclusions are secret, etc.

But we KNOW that someone's taking care of us.

(Court member IDs have been "leaked" a couple of times, but members are rotated frequently, and are often gone from the court before it's known who they might have been. Even when leaked, one is never sure if the info is, or was, credible. Members are picked/assigned by ... guess who(?))

John

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Genie
Date: 10 Dec 08 - 12:18 AM

dick greenhaus - PM
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:07 PM

I guess it's reassuring to see that, as far as corruption goes, there's no partisan politics. Crooks on both side of the aisle.

John in Kansas, I never said Bloggie was wiretapped without a warrant. I was just saying that since we know the Bushies don't NEED a warrant, it's DOUBLY stupid to invite your opponents or the authorities to listen in on your communications.

And, yes, I too regret that we " couldn't get to Cheney."

pdq: "All wiretaps in the past 8 years have been properly approved, as far as most people say. That cannot be said of of the previous 8 years."
Oh, really? As I understand it, current policy allows the Bush Justice Dept. to intercept snail mail, email, and phone calls WITHOUT authorization by a FISA court either before OR afterwards.

Bobert: "But nevermind the fact that Bush and his buddy Gonzalez fired federal prosecutors who wouldn't hang in there for 4 years, 11 months and 2 weeks to try to dig somethin' up on a Democrat."
Hey, Beau Bear, I think ya may be onto sump'n!

And yer right about this:
"They sick... So when I hear a federal prosecutor damning the entire state of Illinois it really pisses me off...

And it should everyone else who has had enough of Karl Rove."

Genie

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: GUEST,MarkS (on the road)
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 10:29 PM

Gosh all peanutbutter - how could such a thing happen?
I wouldn't know about such goings on. I'm from New Jersey.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 10:18 PM

Actually, Rap... I never heard of the guy until today... Yeah, he's prolly a real jerk...

I reckon after 8 years of Karl Rove I look at everything that happens in the political world as yet another attempt to slime the opposition party...

I'm still there...

It may take me a couple years to get it out of my system...

As long as the Repubs are in power I can only think that everything that goes wrong between now and Jan. 20 will be something that the Repubs orchrestrated to bring doubt upon Obama...

I don't understand why this guy had to make the Lincoln or the most corrupt state comments... That seemed to me to be partisan and uncalled for...

I mean, when the prosecutor busted Seriff Danny Pregraves here in my county on 22 felonies she didn't go beyond the facts of the case... No "Page County is the most corrupt"... No people turnin' over on graves...

IMO, that was over the top... That kinda stuff is the kinda stuff that sends the red flag up to me... It's the kinda stuff that we heard in the mad-dash-to-Iraq... It's emotional and meant to hit home...

I am tired of folks tryin' to manipulate me... Jst give me the facts without the theatrics and emotions... We've had way too much theatrics and emotions so when I see them I go to defualt in thinking that that person in front of the camera is trying sell me a bill of goods...

I'm ready for "just the facts" without the political overtones...

Might of fact, I am completely sick and tired of politics... Policies??? That is different... Politics??? They sick... So when I hear a federal prosecutor damning the entire state of Illinois it really pisses me off...

And it should everyone else who has had enough of Karl Rove...

End ot rant...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Rapparee
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 09:41 PM

Bobert, the man had a 13% approval rating in October. He's looted the Teachers' Retirement System even though he was backed by the teachers' union. In January he's facing an ethics inquiry by the State Legislature. He's a scumbag politician who doesn't know enough to maintain deniability, something every Precinct Captain in Chicago learns with their first breath. The reason he was elected the first time was because of the teachers' union backing and the second because he promised to do better for the schools (nobody, of course, got anything except his cronies).

I grew up there in Illinois and I've seen the politicians. Some of them you wash your hands immediately after meeting. This guy requires sandblasting.

You should hear what my brothers (who still live there and who are NOT Republicans) say about the man they and others call "Rod Sonuvabitch." I suspect that this is the top of a great big pile of, well, what you plow into the garden.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: wysiwyg
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 07:31 PM

It's just Flatlander Psychosis. Or sociopathy.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 07:30 PM

I been thinkin' about this thing all day and, ya' know, there's something eerilly similar to these charges as to the ones brought against Bill Clinton over Monika Lewinski...

(What you smokin', Boberdz???)

No, hear me out... This guy has been under investigation for 5 years and all that they came up with after 5 years was stuff that occured over the last two weeks??? And only two charges??? Come on, folks, let get real here for just one minute... That makes 4 years, 11 months and 2 weeks worth of investigatin' and nothin"... I mean, Sunday-school teacher zip...

But these are yer tax dollars at work for 4 years, 11 months and two weeks and all those tax dollars down the drain... I mean, had I been in charge of the investigation I think after a year or tweo I'd call off the blood hounds...

But nevermind the fact that Bush and his buddy Gonzalez fired federal prosecutors who wouldn't hang in there for 4 years, 11 months and 2 weeks to try to dig somethin' up on a Democrat...

But lets even forget that...

Here's a guy who, yeah, got caught up in some funky sh*t that isn't even in the same league as the stuff that Bush and Cheney have done and fine, Fitzie, you caught one... Big fu*kin' deal... Here's a lollypop...

But why Fitzie had to go and say stuff like Lincoln rolluing in his grave and Illinois being the most corrupt state is so blatently partisan an' downright stupid and no one is calling him on it is beyond my belief...

I mean, almost 5 yeras of wiretaps and stings and God knows what else and Fitzie finally gets two friggin counts and now he wants to make some generalization about Illinois politics smacks of partisanship...

If this had been a Texas governor and a Dem appointed prosecutor had called Texaas the most corrupt state in the universe there would be death threats against that prosecutor...

I just think the entire episode, once we strip off the media spin, is just one big ahhh-hah, gotcha game that the Bush administration has pulled on the state from where Obama was a Senator and I think it is nuthin' more than more sour grapes by a defeated party...

But speakin' of parties, I'm sure that the Repubs are happy tonight...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: SINSULL
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 07:14 PM

So...did Caroline Kennedy back Obama with the promise of a Senate seat?

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: pdq
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 07:12 PM

And while he is at it, perhaps he can give everybody an example of these "warrantless wiretaps" that the anti-Bush folks talk about so often.

I believe the president said he reserved the right to order such a thing in event of a national emergency, such as the 9/11 atrocity. All wiretaps in the past 8 years have been properly approved, as far as most people say. That cannot be said of of the previous 8 years.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: JedMarum
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 07:03 PM

Why regret that regret that Fitzgerald couldn't get to Cheney for Richard Armitage's misdeed?

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:53 PM

The allegation that the phone taps were done under the Bush "warrantless wiretaps" crap are not sustainable, as the affidavit for indictment clearly identifies the courts and judges responsible for issuance of the warrants (including dates and times of issue and of subsequent re-issues and extensions) under which the surveillance was done.

While I fully concur that the Bushisms are repugnant, they do not seem applicable in this case.

A bright light here is that the US Atty filing the charges is the same one who managed to get Libby convicted (not of the crimes but at least of lying about them) prior to the Bush pardon. [And do we all regret that he couldn't get to Cheney?]

John

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: pdq
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:43 PM

Perhaps it's the high price of tar?

Petroleum-based, you know.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Rapparee
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:41 PM

Because it's so hard to get tar and feathers these days, Jed.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: JedMarum
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:38 PM

This thing is partyless! This bastard would be the shame of any party. I cannot see blaming the system for the obvious corruption of one very bad actor. It is disappointing he got as far as he did - but they nailed him - and he won't get away with it anymore.

The f*cker oughtta be run out of town on a rail!!

Why don't we do that anymore???

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:27 PM

When there was all the stuff about "cash for honours" in the UK a little time back it was generally regarded here as pretty hilarious. I don't mean the allegations were seen as trivial, but generally people like to see the politicos in trouble, almost regardless of party.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:27 PM

Lemmie see yer hands, Rap...

Awww, jus' funnin'...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Rapparee
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:24 PM

I think that Obama gave the green light because the "President-elect" is mentioned more than a few times in the affidavit.

Let Roddy get himself in deep and then drop the brick on his head before he sullies YOUR house.

I do think that Obama's hands are as clean as my own in this. For one thing, he's too smart and savvy to get involved. That is NOT to say that some around him might have their names mentioned in court....

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:07 PM

I guess it's reassuring to see that, as far as corruption goes, there's no partisan politics. Crooks on both side of the aisle.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Genie
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:07 PM

Yeah, yeah, John. But do you really think politics in Texas and Alabama are any cleaner?

G

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 06:05 PM

Corruption in Chicago or Illinois!!!? To coin a phrase (via Claude Rains), I'm shocked!

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Genie
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 05:47 PM

Actually, GUEST (who really should use some sort of name),
It's beginning to look like Obama's chief-of-staff designe, Rahm Emmanuel, may have been the one who tipped off the Justice Dept, and it may have been precisely BECAUSE Blagojevich tried to get a tit-for-tat re Obama's preferred replacement and Blagojevich was far from gracious when Obama refused to play ball.


Again, though, where was all the outrage when the Bush administration handed out federal govt. jobs, e.g., in the Justice Dept. -- jobs that are not supposed to be patronage jobs -- to political backers and cronies and fired qualified, competent workers in those depts. just for being Democrats?

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 05:44 PM

I kinda agree with McGee... I mean, O.J. beat the murder rap, didn't he??? Hey, when you go wiretappin' things can go very wrong with warrents and 4th Ammendment issues... And, hey, this Governor is gonna have plnety to spend on lawyers 'cause seems that he still has the Senate seat to sell off... He's still Governor, ain't he??? Heck, maybe he can sell off the Governor job, as well...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 05:42 PM

It's all in the fine ooooold American tradition (alas -- and not what they taught us in History class, either), right up there with buying votes, and getting voters drunk and telling 'em who to vote for and, the strongest tradition of all, profiting from the office.

Remember Spiro Agnew? Governor of Maryland and Veep under Nixon (another fine, upstanding American, cough, cough) -- in1973 during his 5th year as VP, the United States Attorney's office in Baltimore, Maryland investigated and brought Agnew up on charges of extortion, tax fraud, bribery, and conspiracy. He was charged with having accepted bribes totaling more than $100,000, while holding office as Baltimore County Executive, governor of Maryland, and Vice President of the United States. "On October 10, 1973, Agnew was allowed to plead no contest to a single charge that he had failed to report $29,500 of income received in 1967, with the condition that he resign the office of Vice President." (Wikipedia to check facts -- but I remember it all reasonably well).

Okay, and back to Illinois, how 'bout Chicago Mayor ("Organization, not machine! Organization, not machine!") Daley (the first one, of course)? Remember, I hail from Chicago's northernmost suburb -- Milwaukee (WI).

But neither Illinois nor Chicago has any monopoly on greed and corruption (not to mention arrogance).

Probably the most honest politian I can think of was Frank Zeidler, Socialist mayor of Milwaukee from 1948 (the year before I was born) until 1960. Took the streetcar to work every day and left office living in the same modest home he started out with. He certainly never profited from the being mayor and he had the best interest of Milwaukeeans at heart.

Linn

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 05:39 PM

Mightn't it be better to wait until the trial is done rather than assuming that all the allegations stand up? I mean, that stuff about "innocent until proved guilty" may be a bit old-fashioned, but...

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 05:35 PM

What, Dougie???

You know somethin' that noone else knows??? You got Obama's phone tapped, 'er what??? Geeze, can I get a copy of them tapes??? I'll give you 100 bucks... No, make that 200 bucks for the tapes...

(Yer biddin' against yerself, Boberdz...)

Okay, make that 300 bucks fir the tapes... Come on, Dougie... We're tight, ain't we???

400 bucks???

500???

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 05:27 PM

If Obama's choice for a replacement was turned down because he didn't offer anything to the Governor, I wonder why he didn't report that to the Special Prosecutor? It should have been clear to the President Elect that the Governor was violating the law by asking for a bribe.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Genie
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 05:26 PM

Bobert's right.
Blagojevich's actions are reprehensible (I'd add, "if only for the chutzpah of saying the things he said on the PHONE - AFTER Congress authorized Dubya's administration to tap everyone's phone lines without probable cause"), but they pale in comparison to the treasonous actions of that same administration.

Where's the outrage over the way the Bush administration has trashed the Constitution and trampled over citizens' rights and human rights in general?

Oh, and IMO one of the worst things about this breaking political scandal is that it has grabbed our quite unnecessarily tunnel-vision "news cycle," thus diverting attention from the workers' justified sit-inover Bank of America refusing to lend Republic Windows and Doors so they could pay severance and accrued pay to the workers before closing their doors.

The Illinois governor's actions are criminal and the story's a juicy one, but we really do have other matters of greater significance to the vast majority of people, and I hate to see those issues shoved out of public focus by preoccupation with political scandal.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 05:21 PM

Rapaire opined:

I also think that the "President-elect" (as he is called in the document) must have given the green light for this.

Based on what evidence? Other than prejudice, of course.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Dan Schatz
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 04:41 PM

Not only did she know about it; apparently she was actually in on some of the phone calls.

They also make several mentions in the indictment of "Deputy Governor A.), which worried me - would Blagojevich's replacement be implicated? But no - apparently in Illinois a "deputy governor" is different than a "lieutenant governor." Thank goodness.

Dan

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: pdq
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 04:38 PM

"Or is Illinois one of those backward states where a wife is not permitted to testify against husband?"

Are you sure that is what you intended to say?

Imagine divorce court if the wife is not permitted to testify against her husband.

I believe the concept is 'a wife cannot be forced to testify against husband'. Seems unlikely that she would, either, but the evidence may be strong enough that she may want to plea bargain.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 04:25 PM

Clearly the bastard's wife is as guilty. Can't tell me she didn't have knowledge of his dirty dealings if he was trying to finagle high paying job for her.

Is she being questioned? What kind of responsibility can the state and federal government place on her for knowing and not reporting such nefarious behaviour in an elected official? Or is Illinois one of those backward states where a wife is not permitted to testify against husband?

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Rapparee
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 04:16 PM

Oh yeah, it does. It's 76 pages long and Section 116 states:

116. In addition, in the course of the conversations over the last month, ROD BLAGOJEVICH has spent significant time weighing the option of appointing himself to the open Senate seat, and has expressed a variety of reasons for doing so, including frustration at being "stuck" as governor, a belief that he will be able to obtain greater resources if he is indicted as a sitting Senator as opposed to a sitting governor, and a desire to remake his image in consideration of a possible run for President in 2016, avoid impeachment by the Illinois legislature, make corporate contacts that would be of value to him after leaving public office, facilitate his wife's employment as a lobbyist, and assist in generating speaking fees should he decide to leave public office.

Talk about thinking too much of yourself!

I also think that the "President-elect" (as he is called in the document) must have given the green light for this.

Subject: RE: BS: Senate Seat for Sale
From: Riginslinger
Date: 09 Dec 08 - 04:14 PM

Word on the street is Rod Blagojevich is about to appoint Sarah Palin to the Senate.