Birmingham play closed by mob

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: cobber
Date: 21 Dec 04 - 03:51 AM

First They Came for the Jews
First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me.


Pastor Martin Niemöller

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: The Shambles
Date: 21 Dec 04 - 03:49 AM

Neil Foster, of the Birmingham Stage Company, said the decision to cancel the play had been made by "cowards".

He said he was now looking at staging the performance at the Old Rep Theatre.

Mr Foster told BBC Radio 4's PM: "I think it's one of the blackest days for the arts in this country that I've ever experienced.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: The Shambles
Date: 21 Dec 04 - 03:47 AM

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/west_midlands/4112985.stm

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: Big Tim
Date: 21 Dec 04 - 03:02 AM

I don't think that the Sikhs are supporting abuse, more like denying it. By their actions they have ensured far more publicity for the play than if they had quietly ignored it.

Today, I see the play billed as a "black comedy". However it doesn't really matter what what kind of play it is, if it's legal, and I assume the that the experienced producers had enough sense to check that it infringed no law of the land, then it shouldn't be allowed to be stopped, not "banned", by illegal acts.

I can understand why the Sikh elders are upset, but they have to accept the law of the land.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 07:29 PM

Progress that must be defended!

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 07:28 PM

Progress!

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 07:26 PM

Interesting that you say that as in Victorian times we were considered the most Christian.
Best wishes.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 07:15 PM

Actually we are the most secular country in the Western world.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: PoppaGator
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 07:13 PM

It's not at all inconceivable that a play might address sexual assault in Christian church; the victim would more likely be a young boy than a woman, but the principle is pretty much the same. No wonder the local Catholic hierarchy is making common cause with the Sihks in this case.

Of course, there have been works of art touching upon various instances of abuse by Catholic institutions, but the general public, *including* most Catholic laypersons, has generally supported a skeptical attitude towards the perpetrators and sympathy for the victims. What's really scary about this incident is that so many members of the Sihk public seem to *support* continuing abuse, not to condemn it.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 07:11 PM

Compton, it is easy to say these things but if it was something that directly concerned your beliefs then perhaps you would be prepared to react in some way. I am not saying what they did is right but as I said before...if it was a Christian woman being raped in a Christian Church....I think I would not feel too happy....to add to that...if I were in India watching it I might feel even more aggrieved.
Best wishes.
P.S I am saddened by the fact that Christian marches are banned in certain cities in the UK because they might upset the ethnic minorities. We are supposed to be a Christian country!.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 07:09 PM

"During a performance by the Watersons in which they included a song about hunting "Dido, Bendigo" a group of anti-hunting demonstrators stormed the folk club, tearing off the doors, smashing windows and terrorising the audience.
The brewery responsible for the evening's entertainment upheld the right of the group to sing whatever they wished, but in the interests of public safety decided to close the folk club and ensure the Watersons were not booked at any of their other venues".

Okay, it hasn't happened yet, but the Birmingham case opens the door.
I'm opposed to hunting,but in a folk club, anything goes. If I don't like it I leave.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: Compton
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 06:58 PM

If we start protesting about everything we do not like....there will be nothing!!........and it's getting like that now!!. Because we do not like a particular thing, should we storm the battlements and have it banned. The behaviour of the Sikh community was well over the top.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 06:54 PM

No! There's a thread about Phil Och's birthday mentioning a play featuring Phil's work. He attacked a lot of institutions. Take "Cannons of Christianity". In the Birmingham Theatre debacle the Catholic Church came out in support of the Sikhs, a coalition of religions. How would we feel as a community dedicated to music and song if a religious coalition rioted sufficiently to get the play about Phil closed down?
This issue is one that certainly belongs in the musical thread.

Actually, it does belong in the lower section. The top area is for music, the bottom area is for discussions of issue that spawn the music, among other things.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 06:37 PM

yes

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 06:35 PM

Shouldn't this be "below the line"?

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 06:34 PM

I guess for me, a Christian, the thought of a play where a Christian woman is raped in a Christian Church is a bit repulsive and perhaps objections would be raised but not to the extent of rioting.
Difficult to put a sensitive and sensible perspective on what has happened really.
Best wishes.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: GUEST,Another Guest
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 06:27 PM

Yes, they are discussing it on the discussion board linked to the news item on the BBC web site, not on an American folk music board.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 06:21 PM

Does no one else care?

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 03:29 PM

The play was written by a Sikh woman and raised issues that male memebers of that religion felt should not be addressed.
However,they mounted a peaceful and perfectly legal protest outside the theatre every night. The Theatre itself had liased with Sikh religious leaders before the play was put on the stage and printed a leaflet putting their views against the play which was handed to every audience member, and also read from the stage before the play started.
On Saturday night the peaceful picketing turned to violence. Police were attacked and five injured. Doors were torn off, windows broken, internal fittings smashed in the foyer and theatre staff attacked.
A production on another stage was for children and the parents and kids were terrified and that play was abandoned and the audience evacuated. The Sikh leaders could not guarantee that the same thing would not happen on other nights and threatened that bus loads of protesters would come from all over the country.
The play was closed because a mob attacked and terrorised a theatre.
Surely a terrible conclusion and a severe setback for all in our community of performance arts.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: Big Tim
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 03:20 PM

According to the bbc, it's a play written by a Sikh and includes in its subject material scenes of rape and sexual abuse in a Sikh temple.

A crowd of people, almost exclusively Sikh, beseiged the theatre and threw stones through windows. The management have ended performances of the play for reasons of safety.

You know they banned Sean o'Casey too.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: PoppaGator
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 03:14 PM

I's be curious to know more details -- what about the play did people find so terribly offensive? What exactly took place that is characterized as "terrorising a Theatre into removing a play from its stage"?

A link to a news report wouldn't hurt. I think we all would understand that there might be some built-in bias on the part of the reporting publication, but so far we have almost no information at all upon which to base an opinion.

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 03:14 PM

Not really. Could you explain?

Subject: RE: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: kendall
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 03:10 PM

In America, the land of the free, there is a limit to fredom of speech. No one has the right to cry "FIRE" in a crowded theater. Anyone see the similarity?

Subject: Birmingham play closed by mob
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 04 - 03:00 PM

A religiously motivated mob have succeeded in terrorising a Theatre into removing a play from its stage in the UK. Estelle Morris a minister for culture defended this action, and on TV made no attempt to stand for free speech and the artistic community she is supposed to represent against intolerance. This is a nationally important moment for all who believe in our freedoms. Lacking leadership from the Government or support from the police the Theatre had little choice but to protect its audience, but this is the thin end of a terrible wedge that must be beaten on behalf of all of us who believe that art,be it visual, written or auditory should not be subject to censorship or bigotry.
Are our songbooks to be subject to the scrutiny of all religious zealots? Will we need their permission to perform our works?