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Lyr Add: Seven Irish Men |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Seven Irish Men From: Lighter Date: 16 Oct 18 - 09:42 AM There was a "George's Street" in New York as late as 1815, but I can't find any indication that it retained the name for very long. There was and is a George's Street in Dublin, however, and elsewhere. This strongly suggests that the broadside was written locally, with a plausible street name chosen to fit the meter. |
Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Seven Irish Men From: Lighter Date: 16 Oct 18 - 08:55 AM Aengus's tune is different again. Don't know where it came from, but it sounds familiar. |
Subject: RE: Lyr Add: interp of 'seven Irishmen' From: Lighter Date: 15 Oct 18 - 04:06 PM The verbose broadside original, from the National Library of Scotland: https://deriv.nls.uk/dcn23/7489/74891286.23.pdf A Bodleian text, from an unnamed printer, shares space with "An elegy, on the death of the much lamented very rev. D. W. Cahill, D. D." The web page gives Cahill's dates as "1796-1864." That dates Heaney's "Seven Irishmen" most plausibly to the American Civil War and the N.Y.C. Draft Riots of 1863 - though the song isn't about the Draft. Instead it's about a kind of recruiting fraud that would have been unconstitutional in the United States. |
Subject: RE: Lyr Add: interp of 'seven Irishmen' From: Lighter Date: 15 Oct 18 - 02:57 PM Dick Cameron, on his Folkways album of "Irish Songs and Ballads" (1961), utilizes the tune of "Dear Old Donegal" (see that current thread) for a more concise and somewhat different version of the song he calls "The Seven Irish Boys." Joe Heaney sings the version he learned from his father - the only other original version I can find - here: https://www.joeheaney.org/en/seven-irishmen-the/ Heaney's tune is unrelated to "Dear Old Donegal." Where Cameron got his own text and tune, I don't know. The group Aengus recorded the song to a third tune in 1978: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oC4Pdg1A24c |
Subject: RE: Lyr Add: interp of 'seven Irishmen' From: Jim Dixon Date: 31 Jul 05 - 01:07 AM The song that Dick Cameron sang was called THE SEVEN IRISH BOYS. It's on "Irish Folk Songs and Ballads," Folkways Records #FW03516, 1961. I listened to a sound sample, and the lyrics seem identical to the ones posted by Paddymac above, where he calls it THE SEVEN EXILES. |
Subject: RE: Lyr Add: interp of 'seven Irishmen' From: GUEST,Lighter at work Date: 28 Jul 05 - 10:35 AM Dick Cameron recorded the song for Folkways around 1960 on his album of Irish Folksongs. |
Subject: RE: Lyr Add: interp of 'seven Irishmen' From: Liam's Brother Date: 21 Nov 01 - 04:09 PM The song is almost certainly from the time of the U.S. Civil War. The Mexican-American War was over almost before it started for one thing and the Civil War consumed vast quantities of human flesh so that bounties were paid to immigrants to enlist in the Civil War, for another. 25% of the combatants in the Civil War were born outside the U.S. and some 250,000 (the actual number will never be known) were Irish-born. One very readable book on the Irish in the Civil War is Paul Jones, The Irish Brigade (Wasington-New York: Robert B. Luce, 1969). There are others. I put 2 songs of the Irish in the U.S. Civil War and 1 song of the Irish in the Revolutionary War on the Folk-Legacy CD, "Irish in America: a Musical Record of the Irish People in the United States, 1780 - 1980." If the topic is of great interest to you, you might want to get a copy from Folk-Legacy. You can read more about the CD at... http://mywebpage.netscape.com/milnerconroy/irishinamerica.htm
All the best,
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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: interp of 'seven Irishmen' From: Liam's Brother Date: 21 Nov 01 - 03:47 PM Joe Heaney's recording was on Philo LP 2004, Joe Heaney. A transcription of that recording is on p. 126 of my book, A Bonnie Bunch of Roses (New York: Oak Publications, 1983), ISBN: 0.8256.0256.4
All the best, |
Subject: RE: Lyr Add: interp of 'seven Irishmen' From: GUEST,MCP Date: 21 Nov 01 - 08:16 AM The Bodleian has 6 (I think) versions under the title: The glorious victory of the seven Irishmen over the kidnapping Yankees in New-York. A few of them are Here, Here and Here. Mick |
Subject: RE: Lyr Add: interp of 'seven Irishmen' From: paddymac Date: 17 Nov 01 - 06:52 PM The first version posted above appears in two of the Hal Leonard books: "The Celtic Fake Book" and "The Folk Song Fake Book". I presume the two are the same, but I've only seen the former. I've also found references to it three Mel Bay books: "Mel bay's All In Americay;" "Mel Bay Presents Songs of Ireland (1991);" and "Mel Bay's Immigrant Song Book (1992)." I've not seen any of the Mel Bay versions, so I don't know if they are all the same or if they are the same as the others noted. |
Subject: Lyr Add: THE SEVEN EXILES From: paddymac Date: 17 Nov 01 - 01:15 AM Here are the lyrics from the Donagh MacDonagh Song Collection linked to by Guest MCP above. They differ from those posted above, but seem to clearly be another version of the same song, though which came first is not clear. I thought it would be a good idea to put them here as a harvesting aid.
THE SEVEN EXILES
He brought them to an alehouse where they got drunk galore,
They looked at one another, and this to him did say,
Twelve Yankees dressed in solder's clothes came in without delay,
Their Irish blood began to flow, which made the Yankees frown, Transcribed July 14, 2000 by T. M. Carlsen Notes from transcriber: Spelling and punctuation as in original
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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: interp of 'seven Irishmen' From: GUEST,MCP Date: 16 Nov 01 - 07:53 PM The song was printed in Sing Out v.22#1 with Joe Heaney listed as the source, so I suppose there is probably a recording of him singing it. I haven't got Sing Out's that late, so I can't tell you if there are any notes there. You will also find a version under the title Seven Exiles in The Donagh MacDonagh song collection You might also try searching the celtic music newsgroups and the Forum (I can't get search to work at the moment, so I don't know if there's anything there). Mick |
Subject: Lyr Add: SEVEN IRISH MEN From: paddymac Date: 16 Nov 01 - 12:48 PM I've been looking for info on this song, without much luck so far. I couldn't find it in a DT/Forum search, and haven't found any recordings of it. I did find a print version in the Hal Leonard "Celtic Fake Book", where it is listed as traditional, but the arrangement is copyrighted. I don't yet know the name of the air, but it has a great "sean nos" feel about it. The lyrics suggest to me that it fits into 1800's, probably in the US/Mexican - Civil War time frame. The Civil War may be more likely because of the thematic similarity to the draft riots of that time. I'll keep looking, but would greatly appreciate the benefit of any other 'catter's comments. Seven Irish Men (traditional)
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