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Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here
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Subject: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Max Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:06 PM Forgot to mention I reserve the right to edit this thread for productivity purposes. I need it to be focussed so I can keep track of all your desires.
Hi Folks. Just wanted to let you know that the next upgrade to the Mudcat is getting very close to completion. It's been a year and a half since our last upgrade, and I have listened intently to all of your concerns and suggestions over that time. The most obvious change is going to be the elimination of the AskSam database and searching techniques. Dick and I have decided that the SQL Server Version (the SuperSearch) is more powerful and more efficient. AskSam has been very helpful and generous to us over the years, and we thank them greatly. Most other changes are minor and have the simple goal of making The Mudcat easier and more convenient to use. I'll try to list some of them here: Various design changes to make better use of the space available on a page. For instance, on the new Forum page, the first thread is 7 lines higher than the current site. This means less scrolling to read what you want. Also, the Quicklinks are a part of the banner so that they are on every page on the Mudcat. Personal Pages overhaul - Easier to manage archive and outbox, optional separate pages for tracer, personal messages, and bookmarks. Links overhaul - Our links page has a lot of great links in there to help folks find great things, but I believe that due to its cumbersome nature, we are not fully benefiting from it. Better Mudcat performance during peak times, and a new Mudcat mirror. More Admin features for volunteers to maintain the high standards we have become used to. There are more changes planned, but are too complicated or subtle to explain right now. I know I am probably a fool for posting this thread and asking for suggestions, but what the hell, after all, this is your site. That's all for now… let me have it. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: JenEllen Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:09 PM You can have a big ol' smooch. Thanks for all the hard work. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: MartinRyan Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:11 PM Many thanks, Max - yet again. Regards |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: GUEST,Pete Peterson Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:20 PM Congratulations and THANKS in advance-- and here's hoping you'll find more time to play the blues (but, I hope, not live them!) |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: MMario Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:21 PM Max, you have already made the only change I was going to suggest. Or you apparently have. Since AskSam is going away - I wanted to be able to do supersearch on forum only or DT only. and I see I now can!
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: WyoWoman Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:24 PM Would having subdivisions in the Mudcat neighborhood be helpful? Blues, Trad, Tavern, Cafe, What I Need, etc... Just wondering if it would make sense as a way of managing the volume of stuff flowing in and out. Is it my imagination, or has there been exponential growth on the 'Cat in recent months? A big robust hug to all y'all who are working to make this community of ours work so beautifully. If there's anything I can do as a volunteer, let me know. I'm willin'. WyoWoman |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: GUEST,Susan-Marie Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:25 PM Max - Could we have a separate forum search like we used to? When I'm looking for something that I know was in a thread, it's annoying to have to scroll past all the DT titles first. Otherwise Mudcat is heaven on earth and I can't imagine improving on it. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: wysiwyg Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:29 PM Most of what you mention is what I had wished for without wanting to ask for it, because you are too good to us already. The only thing on my wish list is that there are bunches of old PM correspondence I was too dumb and lazy to save to word processor as I went along and now it's all archived with inadequate subject lines because I didn't name them creatively enough at the time. If there is any way to purchase our archives on a CR-ROM, I'd pay for that. There was some good stuff in there, not just chatty crap, but some ideas fleshed out that are hard to retrieve now. I am also curious if there is a way to make it easier and faster to clear messages or manage them better from the git-go. (I do try to move those kinds of discussions to e-mail because how much can you store for us???????) And Max. Only make those changes that are fun and, um, helpful TO YOU, to do, OK???? ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Peter T. Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:39 PM Thanks, as ever, Max. One very trivial suggestion: could you make saving personal messages optional rather than the default? For those of us with older networks, etc., they build up really quickly, and have to be deleted individually -- somehow one doesn't get around to it often!! That might save you some space. yours, Peter T. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Morticia Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:41 PM A mudcat mirror??? What is a mudcat mirror?? A device in which to check we look presentable before we post? A glass that shows us what utter plonkers we would be to post that particular message? Something that reflects or causes us to reflect on what we are about to post? Sounds like the very lad to me....probably do us all good. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: wysiwyg Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:46 PM yO, mORTY, WOULD THAT MEAN WE GO BACK TO SNOGGING OUR OWN..... SELVES? Damn Crapslock! ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Mbo Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:47 PM No Morty, a mirror is the Mudcat on another server in case the main one goes down. Kinda like loki was. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Max Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:51 PM Susan-Marie: The DT and Forum search will be separated as MMario already discovered. Praise & Peter T: With the exception of the CD-ROM idea, most of the personal message enhancements are planned for this upgrade. Joe suggested a lot of these changes months ago. WW: I have historically been opposed to separating things in the forum. I am convinced that the lack of separation serves us well. And yes, we have been growing exponentially for about 2 years now. My hope and efforts have and will continue to go towards enhancing the search and similar concepts to help find what your looking for as fast as possible without such division. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: MMario Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:52 PM mirrors, when properly setup, can also share the load of the primary server while being more or less "invisible" - "transparent", actually, (you have to look hard to see they are there.) |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: catspaw49 Date: 25 Sep 00 - 05:59 PM I really like it but the few things are changing so except for the change which I don't like and the other changes which are even worse and then the changes from what it used to be, everything is OK. But if it could be more like what it was and less like what I don't want and you added in the parts I hate but took out the other parts that I hate even more, then we could have less of the stuff that I don't like and even less of the stuff that I don't like now and didn't like whaen you changed it to be stuff that I didn't like to begin with. So whaddaya' think Harpy??? Have I covered the bases for you? You KNOW I try!!! Spaw |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca Date: 25 Sep 00 - 06:02 PM Should I remind you about the accessibility concerned raised on behalf of your visual impaired brethren? It would be nice to accomodate them, in simple measures. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Mark Clark Date: 25 Sep 00 - 06:09 PM Max, From my perspective, there aren't many changes needed. I think you and your team do an outsdanding job here. Perhaps a couple of things I'd like to see: I like to use the trace feature and I have enough of these built up on my personal page that I don't notice when I have a personal message waiting. It would be nice to have a PM notification banner at the top of the personal page. (This is because I don't use the main forum page very much.) The other thing I'd like to see is a change in the action that takes place immediately following submital of a post. Currently we are taken to the main forum page. This takes a long time and (for me anyway) isn't where I want to be. If you'd leave me at the bottom of the thread from which I posted, I could at least back-arrow to my working page. Please keep the "messages since last visit" feature. That goes a long way toward helping me focus on the discussions that appeal to me. I've saved a direct link to that on my Win2K desktop to avoid passing through the main forum page on the way in. Max, the work you and your team do to create and maintain the Mudcat Café is a service to people all over the world with an interest in folk music and blues. It acts as a global forum and resource for scholars, professional performers, amatures, fans and even those who just need someone to talk to. It's astonishing in its simplicity and in it's depth. You may feel like you're out there by yourself a lot of the time but I'll bet there's a whole world full of people who would do whatever it takes to support Mudcat were the chips to be down. - Mark |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: katlaughing Date: 25 Sep 00 - 06:15 PM Sounds great, Max, the only thing I would mention is being able to delete PM's from the page we read them on, but looks as though you have that covered. One of your finest, yet, Spaw!**BG** Thanks, Max and everyone else. Your hard work is greatly appreciated. luvyakat |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Jim the Bart Date: 25 Sep 00 - 06:22 PM Ditto for what Mark Clark said. This is a fine, fine place to be. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Peter T. Date: 25 Sep 00 - 06:27 PM Catspaw is secretly lobbying for "Smell'o'Thread". Resist this, Max, please, at all costs. yours, Peter T. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: campfire Date: 25 Sep 00 - 06:33 PM If it would be possible, it would be nice to be able to put a time limit on a search by user name, like we can on the main Forum search. If, for example, I remember that Catspaw posted something last week I wanted to find again, I could enter "Catspaw" in the USER box and put a time frame on the search, instead of getting everything he ever posted (which may be fun in iteself, but it "times out" my dinosaur computer) I'm not meaning to pick on you, 'Spaw, honest, but it really did happen!!! campfire |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Naemanson Date: 25 Sep 00 - 06:49 PM Max, I ain't gonna try to say the Mudcat is perfect but I sure like it and I can't think of any changes you should make beyond what you've already outlined. Thanks for everything! Brett |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: MK Date: 25 Sep 00 - 06:53 PM (These will never happen...but I'll put 'em in the old suggestion box anyway.)
Two links, under the Thread Name on the main Forum page. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: catspaw49 Date: 25 Sep 00 - 07:14 PM Well campfire...............This posting makes 7597 posts. In an effort to help you, I have done some research and come up with the following statistics:
Number of posts needed to equal the word count of War and Peace...6348 I remember writing those two, but I can't seem to locate them. Spaw
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: bbelle Date: 25 Sep 00 - 07:19 PM Having one's IP posted would be fine, if some people were not using Anonymizer.com software to scramble their IP address, thereby, rendering themselves anonymous. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: MK Date: 25 Sep 00 - 07:24 PM It was only a suggestion. Anonymizers tend to generate the same IP, attached to the originating IP. Some forums also have a script with scrambles the publicly viewed IP, into a series of letters, which can only be decoded by the Moderators...but the scrambled sequence of letters is always the same for a given IP. It was just a thought. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: bbelle Date: 25 Sep 00 - 07:25 PM Max ... whatever you do is fine with me. I've seen nothing but improvements in the last three years, so it never comes as a big surprise. I do wish, though, that deleting PMs was faster. I'm sure that what I've got stored, alone, is dragging things down ... moonbaby |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 25 Sep 00 - 07:45 PM It'd be good to be able to archive or delete a batch of PMs and tracer threads threads at once, rather than one by one. (Maybe it already is, and I haven't worked out how to do it...)
And - I suspect this isn't practicable, but I'll suggest it, just in case it is - if it were possible to do a time warp back to a particular day's threads, that would be fun - it would be a way of finding out if the Mudcat-is-a-shadow-of-its-former-self complaints actually add up to much. (And if they do, it might encourage us to measure up better.)
The messages since last visit - this never works for me, I push it and wait for ages and nothing happens. But it sounds a great idea.
But the crucial thing is not to do anything that would screw up the Mudcat, which is far far better than we have any right to expect. Thanks. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 25 Sep 00 - 07:48 PM Oh yes - and if when I push the submit button what came back was the same thread, but with my post added, I'd find that preferable. That would make it easier to check that any blue clickies had been put in correctly and worked etc. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: AllisonA(Animaterra) Date: 25 Sep 00 - 07:48 PM Max, you are truly amazing. Thank you and your elves for all you do!!! |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: DougR Date: 25 Sep 00 - 07:53 PM What you are doing sounds fine to me, Max. Some of the content recently might be a bit questionable if it uses space that could be better used for music questions and replies, but that's something that the community, itself, has to police. And I don't know if it even causes such a problem. Questions like: What is your favorite cornplaster? These are the type things I am referring to. By the way, what is ...? DougR |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Bill D Date: 25 Sep 00 - 08:02 PM I'll 2nd the idea of being able to search by time frame or time 'limit'..i.e., "last 10 days"...or "Aug.21-Aug27"...but NOT having that is not gonna keep me up nights... It is totally amazing what we have here, and I sure hope you keep YOUR enthusiasm for it half as much as the members do....thanks a bunch |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Uncle Jaque Date: 25 Sep 00 - 08:14 PM Please accept my gratitude for a noble endeavor, here. I tend to sculk around a number of odd discussion forums dealing with an ecclectic array of topics using a wide variety of formats, and it can get a little confusing trying to keep on top of their individual idiosyncracies. Technically, Mudcat is one of the better ones; I like the way a "hot" thread is kept alive by going to the front of the line whenever someone hits on it, then slowly settles to the bottom and dies a natural death as interest wanes. The forum loads quickly in my relatively outmoded system, and is fairly easy to navigate. A couple of things that I'd like to see... they may already be featured and I'm just too numb to figure them out; 1.: Simplified format on postings; elimination of need to use HTML code for line breaks etc., so that lyrics/poetry could be posted in proper form without being all run together or having to paste a little "{br}" after each line. Ability to format chord notations over appropriate sections of lyric lines. Being able to select fonts/colors for postings (I've seen this done but have no clue how to pull it off). 2.: Some mechanisim for posting *.gif or *.jpg picture files, or musical scores from the more common and popular editing/composition programs, such as *.mus files (Melody Assistant). Could graphics files be "attached" to a posting as they would be to an e-mail message? 3.: Inclusion of MIDI attachments to postings - as a link, perhaps, so as not to slow down page loading. This might be a good way to share a tune or two for those who may not be all that musically litterate! About the niftiest thing about Mudcat besides the gifted, talented, funny, creative, generous, and usually very interesting people we meet here, is the "HearMe" feature, where we can "jam" around the globe in real-time. That's just the (Mud)cat's pajamas! I share the hopes of others that sometime soon HearMe will be open to the MAC users of the world (preferred, I understand, by many Musicians), and a "conference call" feature can be developed whereby several of us can sing/play together (even harmonize!?) and be heard by all, performers and audience alike, as an "ensemble". Keep up the good work, Mates, and blessings abundant attend thee! "Uncle Jaque", Yarmouth ME USA |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Alice Date: 25 Sep 00 - 08:18 PM I second Peter's request to be able to quickly delete or save personal messages so they don't pile up.
You and your helpers are doing a great job, Max. Thanks. Alice |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Mark Clark Date: 25 Sep 00 - 08:19 PM Well... there's an issue related to the "where do we go after submit" problem. It's "where do we go after trace." If we're looking at a thread or list of threads, it would be nice to be left where we are rather than moved to our personal page. As it is, it just takes extra time to get back to where we were working. - Mark |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: harpgirl Date: 25 Sep 00 - 10:05 PM ...what Pat said...but why do we have to change anything? I hate change! |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Mbo Date: 25 Sep 00 - 10:15 PM Because nothing can evolve without change. Imagine the state of folk music if there was no change. It would all sound the same and be pretty darn boring. Nothing endures but change. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: wysiwyg Date: 25 Sep 00 - 10:16 PM yeah, what campfire said, about name-searches in time frames, yeah! ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Bugsy Date: 25 Sep 00 - 10:34 PM Max, I thoroughly enjoy Mudcat and heartily thank you for it. I have "messages since your last visit" bookmarked and usually enter Mudcat at that point. Would it be too dificult to have the "you have (?) Personal messages" banner placed on this page? Once again thanks for the site.
Cheers
Bugsy |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Rich(bodhránai gan ciall) Date: 25 Sep 00 - 11:00 PM Max, I've never taken the opportunity to thank you for putting this thing together. It sounds like you got better plans for this than I could think of. The mirror could be a major benefit,in allowing access to threads that time out during peak hours. I've got one suggestion but I'm gonna PM it to you, because it's liable to cause an argument and if it turned out to be a suggestion you decide against, there is no sense in staring trouble. Rich |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Big Mick Date: 25 Sep 00 - 11:26 PM I have been sending my suggestions to Pene Azul for a little while now. They have responded to all of them. Max, you know what I think of you and all the work you do. You folks are wonderful. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Amos Date: 26 Sep 00 - 12:35 AM Max is the Most. Of course anyone with a rudimentary mastery of Latin knows that! But ours is also a First Class Human! If there were any way to capture the plain text formatting of messages even though the transmission was in HTML, as occurs when you choose an HTML output in Outlook, it would save millions of hand-coded linebreaks and para breaks and bold on/offs per year! Think of it! All that energy could be poured into song challenges. If we could toggle each message on the PM page on and off and then "Delete selected messages" it would be super. And if we could forward selected messages through "mail" or equivalent, so we could gather them into our home systems without painful copy-and-pasteys, it would also be super. But you know how it is Maxie -- ANYthing you do is just super, cuz you is th emost!!!
A |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Charlie Baum Date: 26 Sep 00 - 12:50 AM It would be great if we could fix our posts after we've posted them and discovered the horrible typo or the bad html coding that makes a link non-functional or the lines break badly. Yet I can understand why we all can't monkey around with threads and need to rely on someone like Joe Offer or Pene Azul to fix them for us. Still, it would be truly nice if there were an extra button beside "submit meassage" and "clear entries": one that submitted the message provisionally, in a way that all the coding would act just like it does on the Mudcat forum. From that provisional posting place, we could review our posting, and either fix the coding, post it permanently, or say "forget it" and clear the message. It's not for everyday text posts that it's needed--it's for the posts that contain html coding, that, as much as we know the proper codes, have manually placed screw-ups in them. --Charlie Baum |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Jon Freeman Date: 26 Sep 00 - 03:07 AM Sounding good Max. A couple of thoughts though: I don't know how typical I am but I nearly always go straigt back to check a post that I have made so it would be easier for me to remain in the thread rather than be taken back to the main forum. An alternative to this that might also suit Charlie Baum would be to have a preview button to allow you to see what you have posted before actually posting to the forum. I think date parameters on the searches would be a good idea. If I am searching for a past post or thread, I often know roughly when it was made and I would have thought it more effiecient to just select and view the information within a given time period. Jon |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Peter T. Date: 26 Sep 00 - 10:29 AM I have thought of one other suggestion I have made before, but I will give it another go. It would be nice to have, on the main page (perhaps as a permanent link) a place for reviews of current records, books, whatever, on the folk/blues scene. To do these properly takes some time and effort, so the thread (if it is a thread) should not disappear for awhile. It might make a good "Semi-Perma Thread" -- moveable every month or so. I know that there is already a request to send this kind of material, but I wouldn't do the work involved unless I knew that the article was going to be prominent and available for some time. I am sure that other people would have the same reservations. But I would certainly like to be able to reap the rewards of the wise eyes around here on the vast array of stuff coming out each month. yours, Peter T. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler Date: 26 Sep 00 - 10:35 AM (Miles Davis should be playing "My Funny Valentine" in tha background) "Don't change a hair for me Not if you care for me..." Great work, Max , don't let 'em load you with too many changes. RtS |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: MartinRyan Date: 26 Sep 00 - 11:47 AM Max I'm getting some very odd effects at the moment - the number of entries to a thread shown in the list bears no resemblance to the actual number ini the thread. Any ideas? Regards |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: catspaw49 Date: 26 Sep 00 - 11:53 AM Possibly Joe Clones? Duplicate deletions and the like? Spaw |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Midchuck Date: 26 Sep 00 - 12:01 PM I'd also like to see a "preview" feature, so I don't have to advertise to the world what a dupper I am at HTML. An automatic line break when you hit "enter," without having to type the HTML code, would also be nice; especially since so much of what gets put in is song lyrics or doggerel. Of course, I don't know if there's a practical way to provide the above features, because I am such a dubber at HTML. Peter. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat Changes Coming, Suggestions Here From: Clinton Hammond2 Date: 26 Sep 00 - 01:05 PM A preview feature or an edit feature here is an absolute must have!!! Especially if you insist on staying in the dark ages and making people insert their own HTML code.. preformatted text would be some much better... What about dropping the html thing all together and using UBB code? UBB code makes for a damn fine MB... A refreshing window somewhere on the Mudcat with a link to a currently playing folk radio station, be it mudcat or not would be a nice feature... and they're not so hard to find... The possibilities are endless... {~` |
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