Reading threads & not posting?

Subject: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Blowzabella
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 01:41 PM

I'm just curious here - wonder how many people open and read threads but don't actually add anything to them? Is it a lot? Is there any way of telling how many times a thread has been visited or is it just the number of posts that are recorded?

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 01:51 PM

I open a lot of threads, but post only when help is asked for finding a song, a tune, or information themes I am sure I have reliable information. eg. Germany, history, Orient, Islam and son on. Sometimes I am appalled when opening sich treads and read a lot of hate and demeanor. I won't post to such threads (e.g. about Arafat's death) because I know that it is useless to join a discussion with such bloody hateful blokes with boards before their heads (a common proverb in Germany).

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Bill D
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:01 PM

and, (he said guiltily), it might be better if more people followed your example, Wilfried. I get 'involved' more than I should.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From:
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:02 PM

Blow, I think a lot of people open threads but don't type anything unless they have something concrete to add. There are a few exceptions that we know who just post to add something funny (in their eyes) to the comments.

As far as we can publicly access, only the number of posts is recorded. I'm sure that if necessary, the database information could keep track of how many times a thread is accessed, but WHY?

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Zany Mouse
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:04 PM

WELL SAID, WILFRIED.

Rhiannon

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: treewind
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:05 PM

I'm sure I read (or at leat skim through) more than I post to.
Mudcat would have no reliable way of knowing how many times a thread was visited, though web server logs give some information about this. (available to Max, not to us)

Anahata

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:05 PM

Open many to which I don't contribute. Unless I can add something, I do not post. That doesn't mean that they are ignored- if interesting information or lyrics are posted, I may copy them or make a note of the thread. Sometimes I find, much later, that I can add to the thread and reopen it.
No counter on thread visitors here.

I no longer look at the posts below the line.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:21 PM

I open far more threads than I post to. Another reason for posting to a thread is to refresh it, and quite a lot of one liners people put in are probably because a thread looks like it's falling off the page, or has fallen off, and the person posting the one liner wants to keep it in play.

I know you can do that by just clicking the submit button without adding anything, but that seems a bit inelegant.
...............................

"I no longer look at the posts below the line." In which case you miss quite a lot of interesting stuff. It's by no means all arguments about things about which you don't want to read arguments. You even get songs turning up there quite frequently.

And of course this thread is the kind of thread that would normally be below the line, since it's not really about music or technical problems. I would think it is quite likely it will get moved there, if it keeps going on a bit.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Bernard
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:22 PM

These days I often don't bother contributing to threads because of the rapidly increasing number of people who react 'aggressively', which spoils my enjoyment. It's one thing to have an opinion, but another thing entirely to force that opinion upon others...

I have to agree that I can't see what good would come of knowing how many 'hits' a thread has had - the thread will remain active whilst people have something to contribute, and the number of postings is an indication of the level of interest.

Members can add a thread to their 'tracer', which means that a thread of interest is still relatively easy to access even when it's dropped of the bottom of the main listing.

After nearly six years as a member, I've never felt the need (or interest) to know how many 'hits' a thread has had... so my question would be 'Why?'

I suppose we could also ask how many members visit regularly (these days I don't) - that may be more meaningful...

Sorry if this sound inflammatory in any way... it's not intended to be... but people round here often seem to take things I say the wrong way... :o(

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Janie
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:35 PM

I don't post to most of threads I open. I open and read many, many more music threads than BS threads, but am more likely to post to a BS thread, cuz when it comes to BS, everybody's an expert;^)

Janie

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: *Laura*
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:35 PM

I only add if I have something to say. Or ask. I don't much like getting involved in arguments, so I try not to. But it can be hard when people take things you say the wrong way - I agree Bernard.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Sooz
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:36 PM

I must read 20 for every one I post to. If I have no valid contribution to make I save my breath. I avoid political threads, but share many a good laugh "below the line"! (Long may it continue to be so)

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Peace
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:40 PM

I do not agree with Bill D. His postings are always considerate, so I think he's being much too hard on himself.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Genie
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:42 PM

Gotta respectfully disagree with you on this, Bernard: "I have to agree that I can't see what good would come of knowing how many 'hits' a thread has had - the thread will remain active whilst people have something to contribute, and the number of postings is an indication of the level of interest."

As several people said above, one often finds the contents of a thread interesting and informative without feeling the need to add a post. A thread is not necessarily "inactive" just because no one has recently added another post.

Sometimes when people "refresh" an "old" thread, they get chastised for doing so. The chastisers seem to equate the # of posts with the level of interest or the # of people checking out that thread.

Some websites do track the # of visits -- and, ironically, at those websites there are still folks calling a thread "outdated" even when the # of hits to the thread increases by dozens every day! -- but mudcat.org doesn't. I think it's good to keep that in mind when judging how current a topic is.

I think it's fine to use your own judgment about "refreshing" a topic. If it's something easily accessible by a search forum -- e.g., an obvious key word would turn up the thread -- refreshing may not be needed.   But if it's a topic that's still relevant and interesting, but the thread title might make it hard to search for, why not refresh it occasionally? (It might even help prevent duplicate threads from popping up.)

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 02:51 PM

When people take what we say the wrong way, it's often an indication that we didn't quite say it the best way, and that's quite a useful thing to learn for the next time.

Arguments? I think people miss the point when they get into trying to win arguments. A discussion in which we try to explain our point of view, and get to understand the other person's differing point of view, I think that is far more interesting, and there is no reason in the world why it should ever get ill-tempered. It's a shame it so often does do that, but there's never any need to get dragged into losing our rag ourselves, even in that situation.

But if everyone posted every time they opened a thread, I'm sure this place would very rapidly become completely uninhabitable. The only reason for having some kind of a hit-count on threads would be to reassure people that it was normal practice to read without posting - and I don't think that really needs to be done. And a hit-count would introduce a potentially harmful competitive element.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 03:07 PM

I read more threads than I post to.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Leadfingers
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 03:09 PM

I think MOST people READ more than they post , and unfortunately a lot DONT read properly before they post !! I know I only post when I feel I have something costructive or (in MY opinion) witty to add .

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 03:24 PM

I open lots of threads but only post to a few. My reasons for not posting include:

1)   I have nothing to add;
2)   I have something to add but someone else has beaten me to it;
3)   I don't want to get involved in acrimonious discussions/arguments;
4)   When I do post, most of my contributions get ignored anyway.


Doug C

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Deckman
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 03:31 PM

My MC habits have changed quite a bit over the last few months. Because of the amount of anger, baiting and general rabble rousing that is now such a large part of the threads "below the line," I rarely even skim them. And when I do glance at them, there are certain mudcatters I look for. Some names I recognise as frequant posters that usually have something of value to say, and then I read them. Other names I also recognize as people who have NOTHING of value for me, and then I quit the thread. It's rare that I will engage in a thread that has been posted to by a "guest."

On the music threads, I read these frequantly and often post when I feel I have something of value to contribute. Bob(deckman)Neson

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Sorcha
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 03:43 PM

I don't post much any more and I don't read any of the political stuff. I do try to answer requests.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: C-flat
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 04:11 PM

I seen other sites that display the number of times a thread has been opened, a feature I find quite interesting and, depending on the thread content, often doesn't relate to the number of replies.
I usually only reply to something to which I can add to, which hasn't been much of late, but I read the majority.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 04:14 PM

There are many threads I open for my sake because I think I can learn something. I do not post to them because others with more knowledge have already posted. I post to perhaps one in ten threads I do open.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: GUEST,celtaddict at work
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 04:25 PM

I think the ability to read a thread, new or old, whether one has anything to contribute or not, is not only highly educational but also one of the most entertaining features of this site. It is really not all that difficult to bow out, without comments that may inflame and surely perpetuate, from a thread that has degenerated to namecalling and such. I probably open ten for each one I read thoroughly, and read ten for each one I post to. The search feature makes old threads so accessible; without it, there would be far more redundancy of threads. It is especially useful for finding lyrics or song information of those that have not been included in the DT. I like to see an old thread reactivated, though, when the topic reappears; it is then like a new conversation on a familiar topic.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 04:27 PM

There are many threads I open for my sake because I think I can learn something. I do not post to them because others with more knowledge have already posted. I post to perhaps one in ten threads I do open.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: SeanM
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 04:50 PM

Active-to-lurker transitionee here.

Used to post a lot more, and more socially.

Lately, too busy with the band and with our own message boards. Plus, the 'cat has drifted from the kinds of folk I'm interested in. No interest + no expertise + limited time = occasional lurking.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 05:07 PM

So many people who only to post when they have something to say or who are no longer posting as much as they used to.

A quick count of posting records since the beginning of the month, for those claiming the above, gives an average of around 56 posts. That's 4 posts a day each.

Clearly, our ideas of how we act don't match the facts.


Doug C

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: GUEST,Pat Cooksey.
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 05:31 PM

I read evevery few days what is going on here, i find some times a gem, which I respond to, the rest I Ignore. I feel Mudcat is not as international as it used to be, but still the odd time interresting.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: GUEST,celtaddict at work, using the term loosely
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 05:46 PM

I expect many do as I do, and will have stretches of not signing on (or posting), stretches of reading particularly when looking for something in particular, then stretches of increased activity.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Raedwulf
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 06:05 PM

I'll post when I think there's some point to a debate, or if I think I can be amusing. Too often in the last 18 months or so there seems little point. Not least because the rate at which posters seem to hide behind the Guest label seems to have risen, & I can no longer be bothered to debate with users who are cowards, trolls, or both.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: mack/misophist
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 07:15 PM

Perhaps 1 in 10 or 15.

The rancor of the past few months will tone down, I think. The past election was, this time especially, more of a religious war and a clash of cultures. It's not over but the urgency is gone.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Peace
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 07:22 PM

Silver threads and sometimes needles . . .

Some folks post polemics, others one-liners. Some post love, others hate. Some are understood for what they meant to say and others aren't. So it goes.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Peace
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 07:32 PM

However, there is a thread I posted to wherein I said nothing. I thought it was clever (not great wit, but clever for all that, because it really is what I expect to be doing at Christmas. Here's the post:

Subject: RE: BS: What are you doing at Christmas
From: brucie - PM
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 03:00 PM





Post - Top - Forum Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

I had considered writing that I wasn't going to be doing anything, but that didn't feel right. Then I considered not posting. Then, I pushed the button and that's that.

Some people will consider it to be a waste of bandwidth, some will figure it's a waste of space, and yet other's will tell me I'm an ass for doing that. One or two might 'get it'. If it offends anyone because of anything at all, ask for it to be removed. I won't object.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 07:39 PM

Brucie I 'got it' and just hoped you weren't sad. x

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Peace
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 07:49 PM

Thank you, GUEST.

Truth is that if this Christmas is like the past four, I will either be at a motor vehicle collision or a fire. I hope it is different.

Sad? No. But thank you very sincerely.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 08:06 PM

One particular class of threads that I usually read but seldom post to is obit threads. I really suck at coming up with something meaningful to say unless the person who died was very special to me. I would rather pay my respects in silence.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: freightdawg
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 08:25 PM

I read a lot more posts than I post to. Reason is I love the educayshun you can get here on the 'cat.

I've learned a lot about the folk music scene. I've had several questions answered (some I've posted, some due to the good posting of others).

I've read a lot that I wish I hadn't.

And I've run into some really cool folks who I never would have met without the Mudcat.

And one other thing I have'nt seen mentioned in this thread...the Mudchat. I don't go there often, but when I do it is always an enjoyable visit. Several folks who do not post very much go there to do their visitin'. It is usually one huge multi-colored thread that takes place in (sort of) real time. Except, of course, when everyone gets booted out because of a techno-glitch.

(just wondering how many people are reading this post without posting...)

Freightdawg

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Leadfingers
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 08:45 PM

Just out of MudChat two hours after coming home from a session !! I log in Every Day and glance through , and actually look at the threads I have posted to , and any new ones . Like a lot of people I tend to ignore the Flamers and Trolls, but try to answer any proper questions , if I can .

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: GUEST,reggie miles
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 09:14 PM

Freightdawg, I was going to do just that, (read and not post). I echo what many here have said regarding posting habits. There are many threads that I have bookmarked and have not yet had the chance to revisit. Where does the time go?

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: JennyO
Date: 14 Nov 04 - 09:38 PM

Hey Freightdawg, I read your thread without posting - oops, I posted :-)

Now that I'm here - I do a lot more lurking than posting it seems. Almost every day, I skim through all the titles and open (and trace) all the ones that interest me, which is about 1 in 5 of the music threads and a larger proportion of the BS threads - I generally avoid the political ones though.

I usually only post to a music thread if I have some information to add, but I like to play around with the BS ones and add something if I have time. How much I post usually depends on how much time I have. Lately I don't seem to have had much time to add long posts, so there have been a fair few one-liners. There have been some which I would have liked to reply to at length, but never got around to because of lack of time.

I like to drop into the chat sometimes too, but not so much lately - I only do that if there is time - there was one memorable one where a bunch of us were "singing" doo wop songs - I wouldn't mind doing that again!

In the two years I have been here I have posted on average 2-3 times a day, and that includes periods when I have been away too. Some days it might be not at all, and others it might be 7 or 8.

It's easy to forget that if you don't post at all, nobody knows you have been here. I may have been laughing my head off at all sorts of funny things, or enjoying threads like "Divided we fall", but nobody knows.

In fact, I think this has been my longest post for some time, I suspect. Gotta go, my garden is calling.........

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: YorkshireYankee
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 02:52 AM

Like most have said above, I read way more threads than I post to – and for many of the same reasons.

Reasons I don't post:

I'm not knowledgable enough to add anything useful, or somebody else has already "said" what I would say.

Lack of time: For me at least, trying to compose a coherent, thoughtful post takes a significant amount of time & effort, and I don't always have the time and/or the energy for it.

Not "knowing" the person involved: This is in the case of threads where someone is in the hospital/ill/condolences, etc. I sometimes think maybe I should post, whether I "know" them/they "know" me or not, because even good wishes from someone you've never heard of can be encouraging, I suppose – but to me it feels inappropriate to post unless the person in question doesn't feel like a "stranger" to me.

And lastly (and most disturbingly) – fear (every now and then...): I am sometimes tempted to criticise a thoughtless, nasty post (especially when it's by someone who seems to delight in such things on a regular basis), but refrain... partly because I suspect that it won't help & will even make things worse/help derail the thread (I tend to figure the best way to deal with such posts is to ignore them); but partly – I'm ashamed to admit – because it seems quite possible to me that if I criticise these people, they may well decide to make me a preferred target. I suppose that makes me a coward. I like to think that I'd be willing to stand up to them if it would actually help someone else, but that may just be a sop to my conscience – I suppose I won't really know until/unless it happens...

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Paco Rabanne
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 03:07 AM

I prefer things my way round. I post but don't read. oh.... I'll get my coat!

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: A Wandering Minstrel
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 08:21 AM

read many, post to few
always try to respond to lyric requests if I know the words(depends on the state of my ailing memory)

I post a lot less than I used to as I try and avoid the politics

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Mrs_Annie
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 08:54 AM

I feel compelled to post on this one! I come in and browse most days, but only post when I think I have something relevant to say. (or want to ask a q myself) It's always nice when that gets acknowledged.

Anne

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Nick
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:06 AM

ALL forums are the same.

I used to have a yahoo club with 1000 members of which perhaps 30 or 40 would post at all and of those perhaps 4 or 5 would post regularly.

A friend posts to a songwriting site where a handful of the visitors post.

Another friend has a forum with 350 registered users (only registered users can contribute) where he does record the views - some typical threads will have 70 replies on almost 3900 views. In another thread there are 762 replies with 42262 views. Amongst his 350 registered users 3 post very regularly (!!), with perhaps another 10 posting now and again.

Is a lot of it to do with ego? I know a lot of people who read in various places but would not dream of posting.

About the only positive I could see for having a note of the number of viewers of a thread would be if noone replies - if 00's or 000's of people have looked and not given an answer it might be pointless to keep trying, if noone has it might be worth re-phrasing the question and trying again to get the answer.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Pete Jennings
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 09:19 AM

I'm always wary about posting to threads cos they tend to sink without trace shortly thereafter...

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Maryrrf
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 10:58 AM

I rarely post even when I think I might be able to contribute something because I never know how things will be taken and I don't want to start arguments, receive chiding, acrimonious or patronizing replies, etc. I know this is only virtual reality but to to tell the truth although I like some Mudcatters and I really value the information that can be found here, I don't find Mudcat a very friendly place much of the time. There are nice folks, yes, but there are some very impatient, sarcastic and not very nice people too and I often will type out a post, consider it from all angles to try to MAKE SURE that it couldn't possible generate any animosity, only to then think "Screw it, why bother" and delete it without sending. If we could somehow get people to be more courteous I think we'd get more posters and possibly even more interesting information.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 12:47 PM

Counting the number of times a thread is opened isn't necessarily a good measure. I open multiple threads to save having to wait for a new one to load up. Sometimes I manage to read them all, other times I have to break off for other jobs before I get to the ones at the bottom of the pile.
If a thread is a new one, I don't know if I am interested in it until AFTER I have opened it. Some I close as soon as I have scanned the first posting (or the name of the first poster). Others I read in full.
Long threads sometimes need several visits to actually wade through before I reach the point where I can decide if I wish to post.
In general I open threads which have intriguing titles. Some are worth reading - otheres deserve to be ignored.
I post when I think I can be of help, or if I can make an entertaining comment. Otherwise I mainly just read.
Quack!
GtD.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: SINSULL
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 12:58 PM

Interesting thread, Blowz. I have two thoughts. One of the people who admit they haven't read through previous posts and then proceed to agree or disagree what they think probably has been posted. ??????

Then of my absolute favorite thread - Walt Robertson. I read it every day first and last and didn't post until it looked as if it might drop off the bottom. My post was to beg for more. I had nothing to offer. Don Firth PM'd me that day with some words of wisdom I have treasured ever since. I watch for our own Walts at every gathering now and keep close tabs on the memories. The latest - Elizabeth LaPrelle and Jeri as songwriter.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: PoppaGator
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 01:07 PM

Like everyone, I read more than I post (believe it or not).

Confession: I spend more time on Mudcat at work than I do at home. The number -- and even moreso, the length -- of my posts is somewhat determined by how busy I am, whether the boss is over my shoulder, etc.

There are some threads that I read but to which I never post -- those on topics about which I know *nothing,* but which intrigue me by their very infamiliarity-- for example, Morris dancing.

Sometimes I'll be reading with no intention of making a contribution until I find myself reacting to some detail or "subtopic" introduced by another member. That's when thread creep sometimes sets in.

There's no way I could have let *this* thread, on *this* topic, go by without adding something. That probably tells you all you need to know.

Subject: RE: Reading threads & not posting?
From: mack/misophist
Date: 15 Nov 04 - 01:37 PM

Some threads rapidly devolve into personal exchanges. I tend to avoid them.

Some threads become too bitter. Unless it's a subject I have strong feelings about, I avoid them, too.

Some threads are too silly. Unless it's just the right level of silliness. I eschew them utterly.

Most of the music threads are beyond my reach because of my ignorance.

I suspect I'm quite average.

Then there are the "who are you and what do you do" threads. I fail to see the interest but often post anyway. I have too much free time.