BS: Rudeness

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Joan
Date: 05 Dec 99 - 09:02 PM

A noisy group in the room who aren't there for the music? Bars are nearly impossible to control since the management would much rather have people be rowdy and imbibing rather than sitting quietly, listening to songs--they're not going to ask anyone to pipe down. So you stare into the cluster that's generating the main noise, and they either never notice they're being eyeballed, or are fully aware, and stare back insolently. Tough gigs, are bars, unless you have someone performing with a BIG voice, and an audience that is familiar with the singer and his/her repertoire.

Folk clubs in the UK are nearly always above, below, or along side of pubs, but the folk audiences come to listen and sing, mostly, stepping out politely for the occasional pint--and remembering why they came to begin with. In the US, there's likely coffee and cookies, and people come to listen and participate if possible. Luxurious.

I love some of the comebacks here so much I almost wish I still had the opportunity let some fly.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: InOBU
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 08:18 AM

One more come back... There was a very fine singer, on the night which led to my composing the Jack Dempseys Parting Glass... she had just finished singing the Gartin Mothers Lullaby,... Sleep o Babe for the Red Bee Hums, the silent twilight falls... Beautiful, save for the loud mouth pool player screaming throughout, the only loud voice in an otherwize slienced room, and the fool was shouting to show his complete disreguard for the singer and everyone else in the pub - excuse me, in that instance - in the BAR. So, after she finished there was applause, a moment of hush, and I said, in a voice to match the pool player, Well, it goes to show you, a fine singer is a rare pleasure, as opposed to a loud mouth drunken Yabo, who are unfortunately common.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 08:50 AM

Good Morning Larry
My Misto!
You may not be computer literate but you sure can come up with meestow, meestow poems.
Got any poems about the work you do? I'm very interested in what you are doing for the natives.
How do you say......you have a great gift?
How do you say......you are such a gift?
Hope today brings you baxthao sastimos.
Take care,
Bonnie

I'm not one for quick come backs when someone is making me mad.
I never feel good about it in the end.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Blackcat2
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 10:36 AM

Greetings all

I've always got a kick out of that phrase - "you get more flies with honey that with vinegar" My attitude usually is that manure works even better (and to be honest, who in the hell wants to attract flies anyhow?)

A few years ago my girldfriend and I were in a movie and there was a couple, probably in their 60s or so a couple rows behind us. They kept talking on and off. The theatre was mostly empty, so we could have moved but I dislike other people dictating my life. I first "Shushed" them. they started talking again. my girl friend turned around and told them to be quiet. They began talking a few minutes later (the converstation seemed to be that the woman was having dificulty understanding the plot (I never got the feeling she was hard of hearing) Finally, I got up and walked around to them and leaned over and gently said - "If you both don't shut up, I'm going to rip your balls off and feed them to her."

That is by far the most brutal thing I've ever said - and I still regret it to some extent, but they got the message.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Peter T.
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 12:13 PM

Always profreed. (copirite, Peter T., 1999).
I hate seeing movies on video, as I have always loved big black and white and colour movies (video cannot capture the beautiful light of a good 35mm print), but the talking has become so bad that I have evolved a pretty good strategy. I always go to movies that I want to see on the last Thursday afternoon before they are replaced. I am almost invariably the only person in the theatre. If there are other patrons who are talking, I can always move 100 feet away somwhere.
However, this does take away from the "common ambience" feeling of a good film with a large audience, especially comedies. I have a technical solution, which I am prepared to sell to someone. The idea is to provide everyone with headphones, and to have microphones that pick up the general audience sound, and feed those into the headphones with the soundtrack. You would then lose the sound of idiots nearby, and get the audience reaction as well. Brilliant? I think so.

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 12:18 PM

Well Peter T. I'll have to remember that.
Your idea about seeing movies when the theatre is empty sounds like good advice for someone who has gas.

Bonnie RD

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: InOBU
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 01:25 PM

It is good to see Romaness posted on line Bonnie, good to see a proud Romni. Ill post a song for you I wrote about the Canadian Reservation Schools - see the upcoming post Yvettes Song... Nyes Tuka, hai Baxtalay to all Larry

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: kendall
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 02:37 PM

I'm curious Black cat 2 to know if that had been a pair of Hells Angels..would your threat be worded the same way?

A few years ago, an old man was walking down the street in NY city. A pair of young thugs decided to mug him. Bad idea, he kicked 9 kinds of shit out of them. They had no way of knowing that their "victim" was Battling Nelson, former lightweight champion of the world. true story.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Mary
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 02:50 PM

You're a hero for threatening senior citizens Blackcat. Was your girlfriend impressed?

Subject: Rudeness
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 03:38 PM

Yer grandmother used to say "you get more flies with honey that with vinegar"?

I kinda prefer what Al Capone used to say "You get farther with a gun and a kind word than with just a gun"

I'm lucky in that the 2 local pub venues I play are sorta prime for performers... One is an old converted house, the musician in the 'living room'.. if folks don't like it, they get invited to shift and give the seats to people who'd like to sit that close... The other is a large downtown Irish theme bar... the upstairs has stage, lights, monitors, ect.. so if the crowd is too loud, we can always win by turning it up! And by heaping abuse on the offenders! LOL!

Re: the cell phone blight... I see on the news yesterday that places in New York are delairing themselves Cell Phone Free (no exceptions) and I couldn't be happier... Why anyone needs to be INTOUCH 24/7 is beyond me... I can understand doctors maybe... But joe-blow doesn't need it... I laugh at people who bring them to the pub... Tell them, "See, that why I came here, so people CAN'T call me" Besides, they give ya brain cancer anyway! ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: lamarca
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 03:42 PM

When I was in high school in central Wisconsin, we took a class trip to Minneapolis to see a Guthrie Theater production of Euripides' "Oedipus Rex". It was a new translation/production done by Anthony Burgess (of Clockwork Orange and Napoleon Symphony fame), and starred Len Cariou in the lead role.

It was a weekday matinee, full of high school kids from lots of class trips. Some kids were reacting in typical adolescent fashion to the sexual and violent aspects of the play, talking and giggling. Cariou came down to the front of the stage, still in character, and gave a long, slow sweeping glare at the audience, without saying a word. And the crowd shut up.

It was one of the best and most frightening pieces of live theater I've ever seen in my life.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 06:56 PM

Clinton, how true. I tend to always give a kind word and at the same time carry a deadly weapon for back-up.

My sister (who constantly needs me) tried to buy me a cell phone for my birthday. I said "Sherry really, who are you buying that phone for, me or you?"

Banjo Bonnie

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: InOBU
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 07:07 PM

Thanks for the line Breaks Joe Larry

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Duckboots
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 03:33 PM

So you terrorized an elderly man with an infirm wife, Blackcat? Brave man.

Difficulties with hearing aren't the only invisible afflictions to affect the elderly. My mother was stricken with Alzheimers in her late fifties although for many years no-one outside her family would have realised that there was anything wrong with her.

My father, being loving and loyal, wanted my mother to have quality of life and get as much enjoyment as she could. He took her to all the places and events he knew she would enjoy and, along the way, he was helped by many kind and compassionate strangers. I'm sure this has made a big difference in mother's life.

If he'd taken her to the movies, she would have been able to see and hear it but not necessarily process the information quickly enough to follow the story. Dad would have helped her along with some commentary. I can only imagine how they would have felt if someone physically threatened them - and be thankful that no-one did.

Duckboots

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Caitrin
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 04:51 PM

Blackcat, that's just really rather silly. It's what is generally known as cutting off your nose to spite your face. Not to mention, staying where you were (something you obviously didn't enjoy) just to prevent the couple behind you from dictating your life was letting them dictate your life as much as moving would.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: MMario
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 04:55 PM

I'm glad someone finally said it. I was about to gnaw through my toungue....

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: kendall
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 04:55 PM

are you pulling our legs? I cant believe you or anyone would say such a thing..come now, fess up..you were just trying to rile the waters, right?

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 05:20 PM

Hmmmm, interesting. The fact that you were annoyed Mr. Cat, I can relate to. The problem to me is when you say that moving a few seats away equates with "dictating your life". Makes me wonder just how quickly you get annoyed. Fortunately your girlfriend doesn't seem to have a problem with that attitude. Truthfully though, what was her reaction to the "stuffing his balls....." comment. Couldn't you have let them know in other less graphic terms how annoyed you were? You're in the soup anyway, so come on back and elaborate......or I'll cut your.....!"
Rick (who won't even go to theatres anymore!)

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 05:32 PM

Hi Duckboots, good to see your posting.

You have got a point there Duckyboots. When I take my grandmother to a movie I've often had to explain parts of the scene to her or she'd be lost. Her hearing isn't so great, so when I do this, I'm not too quiet. People around me seem to understand. At least no one has tried to rip off a piece of my anatomy and feed it to Grama Marge

BB

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Wesley S
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 06:00 PM

I've recently figured out that if you sit in the last row of the theater that no one is able to sit behind you and talk. And at 48 I'm able to see the screen better as well.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 06:04 PM

It's also more fun to smooch back there.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: kendall
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 08:32 PM

smooch if you must, but, keep it down. My ex wife used to have trouble understanding what was being said although there was nothing wrong with her hearing, so, she would ask "What did he/she say?" I got annoyed with her for this, and finally I said "Look, while I'm explaining what just happened, we are BOTH missing what IS happening." That, she understood.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: catspaw49
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 08:46 PM

Tell ya what Blackcat.....if I had done anything like you did, Karen would have stuffed MY BALLS etc............I get annoyed with a lot of crap, but even I have a modicum of tolerance for the elderly and for kids too.

And now that everybody has jumped your ass, c'mon back and hang with us ol farts

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Caitrin
Date: 09 Dec 99 - 09:51 PM

I worked in the Carmike 12 here this summer...smoochin' ain't the half of what some people are doing back there. My goodness.
The worst thing at the movie theater was not rudeness in the actual theaters, but rudeness by the customers at the concession stands. I had someone get really nasty with me about the fact that the Frostys were out, not like I could do anything about it. People just seem to show an utter lack of respect for each other sometimes.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: McKnees
Date: 10 Dec 99 - 08:15 PM

It is a pity that Black cat is not in Scotland as I could then charge him with the Crime of Assault, by threats. McKnees

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Duckboots
Date: 10 Dec 99 - 10:03 PM

So, if someone threatens you, doesn't touch you but just verbally threatens to hurt you, that person can be charged under Scottish law? I must admit I didn't know that. What are guidelines for laying a charge?

I believe that here, Canada, verbal threats don't constitute an assault. There have many cases where women have asked for police help against spouses who have been threatening and stalking them. It seems that no matter how serious the abuse or harrassment is, the police can't do anything until a person is physically hurt, or worse.

Duckboots

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: McKnees
Date: 11 Dec 99 - 02:16 AM

Hi Duckboots, you'll be pleased to know that stalking in Scotland is also a crime, along with many aspects of domestic violence. Although we do have a rule that says you need corroboration, two sources of evidence. But since Blackcat had the stupidity to do it in the presence of two witnesses all they would have to do is to report it to the police and give statements. As for the domestic situation it is slightly different so that the man or woman, yes it does happen, does not need another person there. Everyone has rights. McKnees

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 11 Dec 99 - 12:56 PM

Hmmmm, interesting. Problem over here is that ANY piece of legislation that might help protect a crime victim, is immediately seen as trampling on the rights of the perpetrator. The defenders of people who do exceptionally bad things are legion. It creates ink and soundbytes for lawyers and organizations needing publicity. A woman (or man, I guess) here can be stalked and terrorized for years with virtually no recourse. (until she's actually been killed). My guess is that a case oftwo elderly people, sworn at and humiliated in a theatre, would be laughed out of court.
Rick

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: kendall
Date: 11 Dec 99 - 01:14 PM

in the USA, there are degrees of assault. Swearing at someone, threatning to harm them is simple assault. To hit someone or grab them and muscle them around, is assault and battery. To hit them with a weapon, bat, rock, etc is aggrievated assault. (And, contrary to popular thought, it does not mean that you aggrievated the perpetrator). If that couple had gone to the police and insisted on signing a complaint, they would have no choice but to arrest the subject. The problem with misdemeanors, is that the warrant must be signed by an eye witness. If the cop didn't see it, he cant sign the warrant. Thats why so many cases of domestic violence never go to court, the victim refuses to sign out of fear of retaliation. Anyway, it could have been worse.. it might have been me that he threatened.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: bseed(charleskratz)
Date: 11 Dec 99 - 01:22 PM

Actually, in law in the U.S., believable threats ARE assault. With actual physical attack, they become aggravated assault. Simple assault is a misdemeanor, most places--but is none-the-less punishable by law; aggravated assault is usually a felony but is usually plea bargained down to simple assault. Even simple assault can result in parole or probation violation and imprisonment.

I agree with Rick that violent offenders ought to do time; the only problem is that jails and prisons are full of non-violent offenders: zero tolerance laws make smoking a joint worse than murder in some states. And then there are the forfeiture laws: someone gets busted for toking up at your house, you can lose your house.

--seed

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: wildlone
Date: 11 Dec 99 - 01:29 PM

somone once called my mother an old bitch in the street,
I grabbed him by the throat and threatened to put his head through the nearest wall.

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Duckboots
Date: 11 Dec 99 - 01:46 PM

So, if I've read the previous posts correctly, Wildone you could have been charged with aggravated assault while the 'someone' would have been charged with simple assault.

People can be very viscious in what they say to complete strangers, I don't understand it at all. This 'someone' would no doubt have been just as upset as you if a third person had insulted his mother, so why would he think it okay to say that to your mother?

I think if any book influenced me it was Charles Kingsley's "The Waterbabies". I remember our teacher reading it to us in school, that's how young we were, and being quite impressed with Mrs Do-As-You-Would-Be-Done-By. If you think about how you would yourself and loved ones treated by others, it's much easier to apply tolerance and consideration.

Duckboots

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: AnTirKitten
Date: 11 Dec 99 - 02:30 PM

On the subject of kids with ADHD and theatres. (Not even gonna touch the assault debate, folks). My 8 year old stepson has severe ADHD. He is on medication. I have it too, though I have never needed meds for it. One thing that I have found helpful in dealing with this in public places is to have a long talk beforehand stating exactly what the appropriate behaviour will be (and rewards for it) and what will be considered unacceptable behaviour (and the accompanying punishment.) Repeat this talk several times if need be, depending on attention span/memory/etc of child in question. I have found that this tends to minimize misbehaviour greatly.

And as for audiences :) I busk a lot so you can imagine what I put up with (for fun, I might add *lol*) and my other performing outlet is thru a medieval recreation society where Bards do receive appropriate respect and I have seen audiences ranging in age from babes in arms to elderly folks listening intently. No reminders. Everyone knows what's expected of them in that scenario. (And for the hard of hearing most performers, myself included, are usually more than happy to explain the piece AFTER the performance :) )

Cat in BC

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: wildlone
Date: 11 Dec 99 - 04:20 PM

If I had done it I could have been charged with defacing a listed building as well, the wall belonged to a 16cent pub

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: kendall
Date: 11 Dec 99 - 05:05 PM

I'm curious Seed, what is your background in law?

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: WyoWoman
Date: 11 Dec 99 - 06:44 PM

Here in Wyoming we have something called the "Domestic Violence Prevention Act" and if officers are called to a situation involving members of a family or people who live together, they can arrest the perpetrator even if the victim changes her/his mind. If they see any evidence of violence, they can arrest the person and at least hold him/her overnight until the perp cools down.

I've actually called the cops on the basis of a couple of threatening phone calls I got and they went to the person's residence and let him know they'd arrest him on assault charges if it didn't stop. That was the last I heard from him.

The thing I try to keep in mind is that only someone who feels pretty puny inside needs to make threats and act out their hostility. It doesn't always keep me from having an emotional reaction to their crap, but at least theoretically I know it comes from weakness, not strength.

ww

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: kendall
Date: 12 Dec 99 - 09:57 AM

Maybe it would help to remember that you have the right to keep and bare arms

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 12 Dec 99 - 01:01 PM

Yah Wyo, it's frustrating that those puny people can cause so much havoc.
Kendall. Perhaps it's just my contradictionary nature, but even though I strongly support gun control, back a few years ago when someone I was close to, had a complete psychotic breakdown and became dangerous, I accepted a friends offer, and kept a 22 caliber pistol underneath the bed for several months. I (and a number of my friends) had not one shred of confidence in the ability (or the will) of the Government or police to protect those who had been threatened.
Rick

Subject: RE: BS: Rudeness
From: kendall
Date: 12 Dec 99 - 09:43 PM

The police have no real obligation to protect any one person. And, these days, the police are unable to protect themselves! Go into any police station, get a load of the bullet proof glass. No, I dont depend on the police to protect me, if you get my drift..