BS: Why closed threads?

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Hookey Wole
Date: 07 Apr 12 - 01:34 PM

Anything been deleted from this thread yet since last time I looked in here ???

It's a right pain in the arse saving threads for offline reading and posterity,
when there's the constant risk of over writing previous saves with up-to-the-minute arbitrary mod interference & butchery....

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Bluesman
Date: 07 Apr 12 - 01:40 PM

No one has contacted me yet with a job offer ;(

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: gnu
Date: 07 Apr 12 - 02:42 PM

McGrath... it's a joke.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 07 Apr 12 - 08:24 PM

True enough gnu - but it's the kind of joke too readily taken as true by a lot of people.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: catspaw49
Date: 07 Apr 12 - 09:23 PM

It appears to me that the most readily available answer to "Why closed threads" is why not?

Works for me anyway.......this is a website........opt for perspective.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: John P
Date: 07 Apr 12 - 11:45 PM

Thank you, catspaw49. That does, indeed, sum it up adequately.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 08 Apr 12 - 12:24 PM

That works for me too, Spaw.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: beardedbruce
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 07:06 AM

Gnu,

The ONE time I requested that Greg F's post be deleted, I was told BY MAX

"Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Max - PM
Date: 10 Nov 11 - 02:23 PM

...

And why would you want it removed? It so clearly shows what he is, so I feel like we should leave it as a warning for the next person that engages him. Truly, though, I would hope it would convince them NOT to engage him.
...."


I then posted that I would reply to Greg F's post with my opinion of him and the reason I thought that way. I stated I would only give those reasons WHEN HE ATTACKED ME first.


YET MY POSTS
That defend myself were deleted.
That stated that my defense had been deleted were deleted.
That asked for a discussion about the deletions was deleted.


AND THE ATTACKS ON ME BY Greg F were left in.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Wesley S
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 08:15 AM

Moral outrage duly noted.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 09:39 AM

A thread that is never opened cannot be closed.

So one can pre-empt any risk of thread closure by cleverly not starting the thread in the first place!

I've done this HUNDREDS of times!

And I've gotten away with it.

And no one has even noticed!!!

God, I'm a clever bastard... ;-D

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 09:42 AM

Poor, poor, pitiful me.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 09:45 AM

I'll second that. ;-D Your position is indeed lamentable. It will probably be made a case study in "Internet rage" (similar to road rage), and will be referred to as a cautionary tale by generations of future students of Internet etiquette.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 10:17 AM

"I've done this HUNDREDS of times!

And I've gotten away with it.

And no one has even noticed!!!"

HA! I've not started way more threads than YOU have not started!...and sometimes, I've not started 3-4 threads on the same topic in one day!

Piker!

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Jeri
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 10:30 AM

Mudcat isn't a steel cage, but some folks treat it like it is. You don't have a right to rip the place apart wreaking retribution on somebody that pissed you off five months ago. I watch Celebrity Apprentice to see people acting that stupid, it doesn't need to have protected status here.

I don't think it's about anyone's "minority" opinions but that they can't stop re-hashing the same hateful stuff and going after individuals personally. There are loads of places on the web where you can go and smack each other silly in front of an appreciative audience. This isn't one of them. Most people don't want to watch crazy people fight.

...OK, so maybe that's not 100% true. I DO enjoy watching crazy people fight, but only until I can't stand the people involved and get sick of the 'blah-blah-blah'. It's easier when I can turn the show off. It's absolutely the best when (and if) I can laugh at them though.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 10:36 AM

As a member of 9 years, deleting and closing posts can be an irritation. What is somewhat annoying is, there is an inner circle on Mudcat who can say what they want, insult all they like and no one deletes their spew.

I imagine my learned friend may somewhat disagree.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 10:51 AM

True. But it's kind of like that everywhere, isn't it? Not that that makes it fair...but think about it. Every cultural and political group of human beings seems to behave in that fashion. The in-group think it's fine. Those not in the in-group feel left out.

I bet it was like that in the year 600 too...no matter what village you went to.

Bill D - So you think you outrank ME in not starting threads? Ha! That is a bold assertion on your part, sir. I once did NOT start 683 separate threads on 411 different subjects! And that was only in the space of one hour.

Match that, sucker!

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Ebbie
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 10:57 AM

Sadly enough, I believe Little Hawk. Fertile mind, he has. :)

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Jeri
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 11:00 AM

Little Hawk, maybe YOU didn't start the threads, you got your other personalities to do it! Totally unfair.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 11:37 AM

BTW. Well done on letting this thread run. There has been a tendency for paranoia to set in any time anybody asks questions about Mudcat workings, and such threads have previously been jumped on with (and without) a grumpy comment or two, by Joe. Then closed!

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: beardedbruce
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 01:42 PM

Greg, Even you have ther right to your post- but as I have told you, it comes at a cost.


As long as Greg F. is allowed to post attacks, I will continue to post the reasons I think he is scum.

The following is from the thread where he proved just how much a scumbag he is:


"Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Greg F. - PM
Date: 10 Nov 11 - 02:00 PM
...
Beardie is also the guy that, in the thread about cash only for second-hand goods, wanted us to know that the sponsor of the bill was a Dumb Ni--er.

Gimmie a break."

His justification for this lie?

Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Greg F. - PM
Date: 10 Nov 11 - 02:31 PM

For Max and Beardie's benefit, from the archives:

Subject: RE: BS: Louisiana Makes It Illegal To Use Cash
From: pdq - PM
Date: 23 Oct 11 - 07:37 PM

Just for the record, the idiot behind this bill is a member of the Louisiana House of Representitives.

He is Black and a Democrat."


NOTE THIS WAS NOT EVEN MY POST, and that Greg F reads "He is Black and a Democrat." as "the sponsor of the bill was a Dumb Ni--er."

THAT is the person the Mod was supporting.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 02:10 PM

Bruce- get help. Please.

P.S.) You might also want to reference my post where I apologized for attributing the quote to you in error.

Or not.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: beardedbruce
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 02:12 PM

Gteg,

I don't need help- you do.

Stop chasing after me and attacking me. IF you want to comment on the substance of my posts, feel free- to attack me is to prove you have already lost the debate.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: catspaw49
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 02:45 PM

Say Bruce....I wanted to mention that this is a thread asking "Why Closed Threads" and you are doing a fine job of demonstrating the reason!


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Hookey Wole
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 02:48 PM

Perhaps it's a distinct advantage to hold the negatives of a senior moderator's secretly filmed late night party 'indiscretions'..?????

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: gnu
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 03:11 PM

bb... sounds like Max gave you the same advice I have repeated more than once.

When a troll or an asshole posts and announces to the world and bares their to the world, allow them to remain for everyone to read. Oh, you can defend tourself and others but you can't be nasty while doing it. Nor can you be seen to be baiting the troll... THAT is trolling.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: gnu
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 06:13 PM

Keep it up and you'll get deleted too.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 06:45 PM

Not if he's Spaw. Spaw claims to have a 25-incher. Or was it 35? Well, at any rate, so long that it's totally impractical, and that's why he's so bitter about it! ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: gnu
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 07:25 PM

Who bitter?

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 07:36 PM

I heard it was the Weimaraner that did.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Hookey Wole
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 07:52 PM

..and folks will forever more be left wondering why Little Hawk is randomly verbal riffing on penis length
in a thread legitimately discussing thread closures and deletions...????

oh well..

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Bert
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 08:47 PM

If you knew Little Hawk you would know that everything he does is perfectly rational.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Dorothy Parshall
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 10:19 PM

This is intriguing. Partly because it falls into the same dumb back and forths that cause me to just quit. Children bickering mindlessly.

BUT i had the experience recently, on a very different group, of people getting their knickers in a knot over my postings and in the midst of what I considered such shear idiocy that my head was spinning, the dumbest of the lot referred to me as a troll. When she resorted to name calling, I knew for a certainty that she was not fit to be a pre-school teacher. I stopped posting but read the rest.

Someone said the thread should be closed. Why? because other people might get upset. Apparently, these alleged adults had pmed the head honcho wailing that I was behaving badly. I thought I was the one being attacked but it would never occur to me to go whining to the boss.

Now I need to write a blog on "what constitutes abuse" and hope the fools read it. A couple people pmed me in support.

On mudcat when things get, imo, dumb, I just don't bother anymore. This other was so shocking and so idiotic, I never realized how bad it was until the name calling. I can see how that could happen to someone here but - hey - just give it up. Or do men just have to keep on regardless - like the charge of the Light Brigade?

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Songwronger
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 11:55 PM

I worked up a post the last time I was here, some response to someone, and when I went to click the post button, I saw that the thread was closed. Irritating.

I've had posts deleted. The last was when I was imitating "a ol' hillbilly" in the style of a resident jackass, and I guess my braying hit a nerve.

It does indeed seem that the people with their fingers on the delete button are thin-skinned.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Hookey Wole
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 12:36 AM

To prove a point, one of tonight's [UK time] duty mods
has more than amply demonstrated gripes under discussion here,
even within this thread.

Though, latecomers will never know how or why
Little Hawk is indulging in seemingly irrelevant random 'penis gag' banter !!???

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 05:23 AM

This is the correct one:

Well now, this is really interesting, 'Hookey Wole' makes a comment that this is going on in the U.K, and they're checking out us, here.
Now before I go any further, imagine, for a moment, that my post is calm, as my general demeanor...and we're all in a room, chatting pleasantly......no hateful, intentions, and nobody driving an agenda...OK?..Calm....

Interesting to note also, is the discussion about 'personal attacks'...and 'trolls'...and bickering......So, let me shed a little light, on what has become a predictable....(oh so predictable)...progression, and just ask a couple of simple questions..(being as I'm only a 'guest' on here, I can be pretty objective of what I've seen...and been subjected to).

A 'troll' is someone who prowls around finding obnoxious things to say, and lures people into nasty, resentful nonsense, just to fuck with them, right?...(or close to).......and they use 'personal attacks', and veer off the topic of the thread, while they banter on with their hateful, resentful semi-literate diatribes. More often than not, backed up with facts(?)..some wish to discuss intelligently, with hopefully intelligent people, so they can exchange input...about a particular subject.....and Lord knows, maybe ideas are shared, and knowledge and intelligence grow...to the benefits of interested people..either regulars, or people just 'poppin' in'...And of course, 'trolls' with their personal attacks just give Mudcat (or any online forum) the appearance of a home for obnoxious morons...right?

Now that we've established that, I need to ask a couple of questions. You know what they say, "A well placed question can change a life."
(inside 'psych-speak').

Has anyone really noticed who is most vocal about 'trolls' and 'personal attacks'??...and what they say about it, and them('personal attacks')?
Valid point! So I need to ask those same people, "Would you classify calling someone a 'racist' or a 'bigot' a personal attack?.....or is it just an 'impersonal tactic'?...without regard for the feelings of who you accuse, when they may not even have a 'racists' or 'bigoted' bone in their body??? Is it personal or not? Has anyone on here regularly, maybe out of frustration used that tactic, when they have run out of info to support their position in a discussion, supportive to the 'side' they have taken?...in other words, when you run out of bullshit, have you just resorted to 'name-calling'??.....and steer the tread into meaningless drivel???.....Didn't we just say that's what the 'trolls' do???
Has anyone else noticed that the chief and most vociferous whiners, are the very same people who routinely use the words 'bigot' and 'racists' in accusatory language???...Yes!..the SAME ONES!!..and you can go back and check any time you want..it's all there.

Now, as to 'deleted threads', in conjunction with the previous.
This is the tactic:...Any number of opinionated half-wits get involved with a topic, on a controversial issue...he sees that he is in trouble of 'winning his point'(usually because he is wrong due to political indoctrination that he never checked out)...so, seeing he is in trouble, he contacts any number of vocal 'know nothings' to back him up....and they all proceed to gang-bang, and tag-team, the person who isn't convinced by ANY of their nonsense....the thread turns into a 'squabble-fest'...with of course, the usual 'idiot-trolls' screaming 'racist!' and 'bigot!'...the rest of the moronic posse chimes in....and NOTHING IS SHARED, that could have been....and that gives reason for one of the nit-wits to request the thread being shut down..ITS THERE, check it out for yourselves!!..matter of fact, all over the place!

On another thread, one of the morons posted my name, and tried to have it appear as if I was requesting closing the thread . ..and it was closed. When I saw that I post that I DID NOT put that up, and asked to have it removed. It was. Joe, or whomever, removed it. He knows from the IP address who it is. Same person who answered 'Delete it'...when asked how he'd handle a thread he didn't like....and a bunch of true stuff was deleted......including a post about Martin & Zimmerman, and a link to the story about how the 'news' media doctored the 911 call, and the divisions that resulted in it. For some lame-ass reason, some wannabe agitator didn't want YOU to know that this whole heated discussion had more to do with the fucked up media's political agenda, than reporting the news....and, by the way, I AM a recording engineer, and I've listened VERY!...VERY!! closely to the recordings of that call and, and there is NO WAY that it was done unintentionally!
Do you mean there are those in here, who's political orientation is so fucked-up that they would stubbornly promote a lie and suppress FACTS, just so they can feel 'important' to the 'cause'????..built on lies???....and shut people up who are speaking the truth...because for them to 'enjoy their sense of importance' they take it upon themselves to fuck you up, too??? ..and you want buy into it???...and can't see that for what it is???...and you want to promote bullshit, supported by sheer bullshit???? That get's you off???
Meanwhile, in the real world, somebody just coming through, sees this behavior.....and just writes off Mudcat for being a bunch of senile wannabes suffering from diaper rash from their 'Depends'....is that what you bring in here???

So, in closing, for now, there will be some who completely understand what I'm saying....and some jack-ass moron will pretend he didn't understand a bit of it, some will be pissed off for being exposed, but the only real or good thing that can come of it, is to resolve to make it better.....and try, if you can't 'win' your argument, at least consider that the guy you feel you need to call libelous names at, is probably smarter than you, on the subject, and shut your mouth for a few moments, and attempt to discipline yourself to actually learn something, or ask inquisitively more questions on it...as if you could actually be interested in something more than proving what stupid opinionated jerk sounds like when trolling!!!
Fair Enough???

Waving, and Smiling Calmly

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Bluesman
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 05:34 AM

Excellent post GfS. Well said.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Musket
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 05:40 AM

Q.

Just noticed your post.

I said "taking the piss" not "taking a piss."

If you can't tell the difference, you shouldn't have won the war of independence before we taught you how to speak correctly (and make cheese.)

(Is that what you meant GfS?)

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 06:09 AM

Thank you, bluesman!!!

It would serve us well to have those recent posts of mine that were deleted, put back up, and let other discuss it rationally...and maybe get to the bottom of the root cause of the divisions...I mean, are the musicians who came from and through the '60's movements to be rendered neutered, by political ideologues, who still think Jerry Rubin, DIDN'T become a stockbroker, and was either wrong in the '60's, as he said...or wrong now...but some of you are still hung over, stuck with his bullshit??????

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 06:23 AM

Ian Mather: "Just noticed your post.
I said "taking the piss" not "taking a piss."
If you can't tell the difference, you shouldn't have won the war of independence before we taught you how to speak correctly (and make cheese.) ...
(Is that what you meant GfS?)"


I believe I covered that in my last paragraph:


"So, in closing, for now, there will be some who completely understand what I'm saying....and some jack-ass moron will pretend he didn't understand a bit of it, some will be pissed off for being exposed, but the only real or good thing that can come of it, is to resolve to make it better...."

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: beardedbruce
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 07:16 AM

"Do you mean there are those in here, who's political orientation is so fucked-up that they would stubbornly promote a lie and suppress FACTS, just so they can feel 'important' to the 'cause'????..built on lies???....and shut people up who are speaking the truth."


YES.



Spaw,

YOU state:
"Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: catspaw49 - PM
Date: 09 Apr 12 - 02:45 PM

Say Bruce....I wanted to mention that this is a thread asking "Why Closed Threads" and you are doing a fine job of demonstrating the reason!


Spaw"

WHEN I POST GREG F's OWN POSTS, demonstrating his lies, and BLAME ME????

You really want to support the racist scum??

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Bluesman
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 07:32 AM

If you post a comment disagreeing with any of the inner fraternity, the response you receive is guaranteed to contain either if not all of these words, fascist, racist, xenophobic, Hitler or troll.

Sad really, Displays a lack of debating skills.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Barb'ry
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 07:54 AM

I don't know about the inner fraternity - I don't post very often - but some posts have been racist, facist etc etc and others just 'generally offensive'! There seems to be a fine line between debate and just sniping and bitching, which then leads to 'he said, she said' and a general breakdown in the original thread and subsequent debate.

When a thread gets down to just 3 or 4 people repeating the same thing with personal attacks thrown in, maybe it is time to stop the thread and let the people involved email or pm it out between them?

There are always people in every online forum who get their jollies by throwing spanners in the works, provoking arguments and trying to score political points: it would be wonderful if they were instantly recognised and ignored - but that isn't going to happen.

As several people have said, maybe sticking to topic, stopping a minute to think before posting, definitely thinking twice before posting in a flip/ironic/taking the piss style (of which I have been guilty) and not having a knee jerk reaction to inflammatory posts might work - or not - but at least it might keep the debate/interesting part going.

Whichever way out, Mudcat is a fantastic place, a great resource and I'm really glad to be part of it - good bits and bad!

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Bluesman
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 08:05 AM

As I said before, if a thread get heated or abusive, it should be put on ice of 24 hours to allow posters to cool off. When it reopens, it should start with a polite request to keep it civil, if that fails, transfer it to the chat room and allow the gladiators and lions fight it to the death.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Megan L
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 08:09 AM

strange how many of the people arguing on this thread are men ah the joys of testosterone overdose.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 08:52 AM

It causes baldness, in both men and women.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: GUEST,Bluesman
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 09:10 AM

Indeed it does, men of a certain age accept it, women rarely do.

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Musket
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 10:28 AM

Absolutely, GfS. It was an earlier comment from Q addressed to me that I picked up on and then noticed that the post you just sent in summed it up completely. Thanks.

Rattling on about Americans not understanding English was of course my attempt to show how thread drift can lead to closed threads? Especially if you criticise the concept of spray on cheese....

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 10:33 AM

You think cheese from a can is bad? You who eat Marmite? Give Me A Break . . .

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 10:51 AM

I'm sorry that the 'How big is your cock' thread was closed. For one reason only. When followed by 'Expert on marriage opens mouth' you score double points, in the Thread name Game ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Why closed threads?
From: Musket
Date: 10 Apr 12 - 10:57 AM

Don't get too many complaints, but thanks for enquiring.

Ian