Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer

Subject: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Alan B
Date: 03 Apr 99 - 02:51 AM

Following the thread about folk musice & social change, got me thinking, both Flanders & Swann & Tom Lehrer's music reflect the times in which they lived. Tho not folk music by the normal standard they said a lot about the way we lived & our attitudes, with a great deal of humour. Does anyone know of their songs being used in folk circles?
If not, should they?

Alan B

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Barbara
Date: 03 Apr 99 - 08:58 AM

Of COURSE their songs are used in folk circles. Why not?
The main limiting factor is that a number of them are rather hard to sing without a piano. They take something from patter and music hall songs, so you have to be able to deliver words and tune clearly and quickly.
And it's sometimes hard to grasp the multiple key changes without adequate accompaniment.
I suspect a number of people who don't know that Tom Lehrer wrote "The Irish Ballad" (commonly called Rickety Tickety Tin), sing it at folk gatherings.
Ditto the "Hippopotamus Song".
Blessings,
Barbara

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From:
Date: 03 Apr 99 - 09:28 AM

I believe that Tom Lehrer not only lived, but yet lives. Last I knew he was teaching math at Univ. of Calif., Santa Cruz. At the height of his popularity he did that at Hahvahd. Don't think he has performed professionally for years. Of course, if he has died that would explain lack of performing.--John

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 03 Apr 99 - 03:34 PM

Ahh, Tom Lehrer. Brilliant songwriter, wonderful satirist. "The Folk Song Army" is so funny it often offends folkies, so I stopped singing it a few years ago. "Remember the war against Franco. A place where each of us belongs. He may have won all the battles....but we had all the good songs!!"

His album "That Was the Year that Was" contains the most brilliant collection of REAL satire that I've ever heard. His successor in the realm of piano playing funnymen, Mark Russell, is so lame, predictable and un-funny, it disappoints me that he even has an audience.

You're right about the accompaniements...Gotta learn your diminished chords before you can play Tom's stuff on the guitar. There is a good songbook of his material on the market though.

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Bev and Jerry
Date: 03 Apr 99 - 03:50 PM

Tom Lehrer's material is well known among the folkies we hang out with. If someone does one of his songs, several people will surely follow with others. We even heard several of his creations at a folk music club in Yorkshire.

We often sing Pollution in schools during our program on Environment and Ecology and, yes, we often mess up the chords.

We heard an interview with him on the radio many years ago and he said that he has written a total of less than forty songs. Nearly all of them are well known. Not many songwriters can say that.

Flanders and Swann are pretty well known, too. There was a question on Jeopardy within the last week involving Glorious Mud.

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: bseed(charleskratz)
Date: 03 Apr 99 - 05:16 PM

Was it Flanders and Swann who wrote "Have Some Madiera, M'dear"? The Limelighters recorded it (I know they often wandered a long way from "folk" in the purest purist definition. --seed

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From:
Date: 03 Apr 99 - 07:34 PM

BSeed- affirmative to both.--John

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Alex
Date: 03 Apr 99 - 07:50 PM

"Madiera" was Flanders and Swann. One of the guys who comes to our Open stage gets around the piano accompaniment problem by doing this as a recitation a la Hoffnung. If you are looking for the modern successor to Tom Lehrer, check out John Forster. Also a brilliant pianist and satirist, he has two albums out on Philo. "You don't need me any more. You've got John Forster" - Tom Lehrer, Harvard Magazine. "Entering Marion" is Forster's debut album and the title track is an elongated pun on New England town names. On the rest of the CD, he guts Paul Simon, McDonalds Corp., Germany, Japan, Shallow people and Codependent people. "Fusion" is a brilliant take-off of Paul Simon and in "Whole", his commentary on the reunification of Germany, he throws in everything, including the Valkeries. On his second CD, "Helium", the title track warns on the dangers of doing balloons. He examines the army's approach to homosexuality, ". .you'll have to serve your country in the closet." There's a take-off of Prince Charles and the OJ story with a twist, "The Juice A La Seuss" Get them both - you'll bust a gut.

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Barbara
Date: 04 Apr 99 - 03:42 AM

Ah yes, John Forster is wonderful, and to blow the puns that you have to ROTFLYAO through a whole song for, "Entering Marion" is entirely bad enough without the tag about being the Marion kind.
Have some Madiera, M'dear has one of my favorite lines ever in a song:"Raising her eyes, his hopes, and the glass"
Right up there with "I lit a thin green candle to make you jealous of me/But the room just filled up with mosquitoes; they'd heard that my body was free..." Course maybe Leonard Cohen wasn't trying to be funny. As far as I know Tom Lehrer still teaches math at UCSC, though he doesn't perform anymore as far as I can tell. My bro had a class from him a while back.
Blessings,
Barbara

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Alan B
Date: 04 Apr 99 - 04:05 PM

Thanks for all your comments Points taken. I think they were both wonderful and without peers. Its the piano hing which had me stumped as well. Might take courae and have a go!

AS I like songs of affection, Have some Madiera and I hold your hand in mine will be the right place to start!

Alan B

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Susan A-R
Date: 04 Apr 99 - 10:11 PM

The Tom Lehrer book is "Too Many Songs By Tom Lehrer (with not enough drawings by Ronald Searle. published by Pantheon here in the states, also original publication was through Eyre Methuen in Great Britain. It has most of his songs in it, I believe including all songs from the three albums I know of. Also I've heard a rumor that there's a Flanders and Swann book out there in great Brittain. We've written out a number of the songs for a program we did last year, including The Gas Man Comenth, I'm a Gnu, The First and Second Law of Thermo Dynamics, The Hippopotomus (sp???) song (which is in RUS) and Ill Wind. I'll ask the boss if we can possibly figure out how to share 'em. Snail mail may have to be it, though, if he even went as far in the writing out proocess as I believe he got.

Susan

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Ralph Butts
Date: 05 Apr 99 - 07:58 AM

I sing a lot of the Lehrer stuff, and use his songbook extensively.

Following up on Rick's comment, this book is an excellent place to learn how/where to place some (perhaps uncommon) chords to achieve a certain effect.

Try to listen to some of his recordings, because Tom's delivery is a veritable school of phrasing, presentation and timing........not to mention fun!

.....Tiger

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Alan B
Date: 05 Apr 99 - 02:33 PM

Thanks again I've got all LPs I know of of TL & F&S, and have gleaned many lyrics from the INternet, but not the complete set of F&S. Any contributions gratefully recieved. (I'll have to check which are missing)

Alan B

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: AndyG
Date: 06 Apr 99 - 05:00 AM

Oh Barbara,
She lowered her standards, by raising her glass,
Her courage, her eyes and his hopes.

Start your web search here for Tom Lehrer and here for Flanders & Swann

AndyG

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 07 Apr 99 - 03:56 AM

Tom Lehrer is still going - atleast he was about six months ago, when the BBC did a radio programme about him. He's still teaching, and still plays the piano. A few years back, another BBC radio programme looked him up to see what had happened to him. He said then that he'd stopped writing his songs because he just couldn't make jokes any more about things that were no longer funny.

Steve

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Barbara
Date: 07 Apr 99 - 04:24 AM

Oooo, Andy. You're right, I misremembered it. Better check the dosage on my Geritol.

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Ferrara
Date: 07 Apr 99 - 08:08 AM

Lord, this is bringing up memories, mostly of my college days. I had friends who owned the first Tom Lehrer songbook, and we banged the stuff out on the piano and sang most of the songs. I was majoring in math so "Nikolai Ivanovich Lobachevski" was one of my favorites. Had another friend who only sang one song: "Have Some Madiera, M'Dear?" but he sang it *perfectly." He was a wonderful, sweet guy but when he sang that song he transformed himself into a sleazy old lecher. Always thought it must be his alter ego.

One member of FSGW sang The Irish Ballad about three or four times a year for too many years. The last line, of course, is "You've yourselves to blame if it's too long, you should never have let me begin." One night he picked up his guitar, sang "About a maid I'll sing a song ... " and the whole room shouted "STOP!!!" He stopped, but he looked pretty puzzled. " -- We're not going to let you begin!"

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Penny
Date: 10 Apr 99 - 08:07 AM

There is definitely a F & S songbook, which I saw at my sister's, but couldn't look at too obviously once I saw the note at the beginning from my wandering brother-in-law. I'll try the library to source the ISBN no.

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From:
Date: 10 Apr 99 - 10:16 AM

The F&S songbook and the TL Songbook are both still available. Do a search on any of the large on-line book sellers and you will find them.

Yours in-cahoots

Graham

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 10 Apr 99 - 12:07 PM

Not to belabor a point, but try checking out Lehrer and Flanders in DigiTrad.

Subject: RE: Flanders & Swann, Tom Lehrer
From: Penny
Date: 10 Apr 99 - 12:52 PM

"The Songs of Michael Flanders and Donald Swann" Elm Tree Books and St. George's Press, ISBN 0 241 89738 6

This was the 1980 impression