Fretless guitar

Subject: Fretless guitar / fiddle with frets
From: Pete
Date: 04 Apr 99 - 09:01 AM

I play fiddle and guitar and was wondering has anyone played a fretless guitar or a fiddle with frets?

Pete

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Barbara
Date: 04 Apr 99 - 11:17 AM

Gordon Bok plays a cello-like instrument with frets (that was created at his behest, I believe), related to the viola-da-gamba. Haven't heard of smaller ones, though. I've heard him call it a cello-da-gamba, and a cellombalonio.
Blessings,
Barbara

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 04 Apr 99 - 01:45 PM

I think Gordon has settled on the name: "cellamba." Nice contraction of 'cello and viola da gamba.

Fretless banjos were common among the folk around Beech Mountain, North Carolina, when I was collecting down there. Frank Proffitt was a master of the instrument, but his guitar and his mountain dulcimer both had frets. Frank Proffitt, Jr. is carrying on the family tradition, by the way, performing the wonderful songs and tunes of his heritage.

Sandy

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 04 Apr 99 - 01:58 PM

I experimented with a fretted fiddle a few years ago and it worked to a certain extent. Your pitch up the neck is always spot on , but you can't get the slurs and slides, and that makes it less fun. I abandoned the idea after about a year. I've played a frettless guitar and it's fun. Someone reasonably prominent plays one but I've forgotten who it is. The banjo player with fiddler Ralph Blizzard (Rounder Records) plays all over the neck beautifully on a fretless instrument.

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From:
Date: 04 Apr 99 - 10:47 PM

I had a friend who converted a guitar to a fretless one (Don't worry, it wasn't one that someday would be a collector's delight.) Rather than removing the frets and filling in the holes, I suggested that he file down the frets and then smooth them with fine carbide paper until they couldn't be felt anymore.

The funny thing was at first he kept playing out of tune because he put his fingers behind the frets which he could still see, whereas he should have put them on them.

I imagine you can make a fretted violin by tying Nylon monofilament fishing line around the neck to make frets. Then you can move them around for different temperament, or remove them for fretless playing. That is the way the frets were on the viol family (except, of course they used gut instead of nylon.)

Murray

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Ronn
Date: 04 Apr 99 - 10:53 PM

I have vague memories of seeing Pete Seeger on television (Rainbow Quest, probably) playing a fretless banjo that someone had made for him. About 3 years ago I heard a stroling musician at a Serbian restaurant in Milwaukee who played a string bass with frets. She said it was Czech-made, built around 1850. I havent seen one before or since.

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Bert
Date: 05 Apr 99 - 09:19 AM

I tied some wire frets on my oud once but pulled the head off by tuning it too high. Just another fixit job I have lined up.

Bert.

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Hank
Date: 05 Apr 99 - 09:22 AM

I've never seen a fretless guitar, but the only time I've ever heard a bass line that I liked it was on an electric bass, fretless. Why are bass lines generally so boring, I heard some wonderful music from that thing, even though it was electric and my tastes are acoustic. I've been considering taking the frets out of my mandolin so I can try some of that, but that WILL wait a while. Probably I'll learn fiddle first, and then if that goes well remove the frets. (I'm not stuipd enough to mess with any insterment in that way unless I'm sure of what I'm doing)

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Ronn
Date: 05 Apr 99 - 11:07 PM

Hank, I'm afraid I have to take some exception. I am a bass player and my preference is for fretless electric bass. But most bass lines are exactly what they are supposed to be--the bottom on which the rest is built. Our's is most often a supporting role, one I gladly fill. Bass players who insist on stepping out in front too often are the ones that I find boring. Even if the bass line is a simple I-V-I-V style, you'd miss it if it wasnt there.

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Frank in the swamps
Date: 06 Apr 99 - 04:42 PM

I find Bass lines in most folk music are dreadfully dull, but as Ronn sez' you'd miss it if it wasn't there. I think different styles are more conducive to Bass activity than others. I like to hear blues players get more imaginative with it, the blues is very conducive to harmonic activity from the bottom end. I'm not sure if bluegrass will ever get past the "corn jug" bass line though.

Frank i.t.s.

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Frank in the swamps
Date: 06 Apr 99 - 04:46 PM

Hmm, didn't mean to imply that bluegrass "should" get past the I-V-I-V, just that I think it would have an adverse effect on the character of the music.

Frank i.t.s.

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Arkie
Date: 06 Apr 99 - 05:13 PM

Gordy Hinners is the fretless banjo player with Ralph Blizard and the New Southern Ramblers. The speed and intricacy of his playing is amazing to me, and it works nicely with Ralph's fiddling.

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 06 Apr 99 - 08:02 PM

At the suggestion of a fiddler friend I bought a Chinese made Lark violin which had 'frets' which were concave, and which worked quite well. (His idea was that these instruments were quite reasonable quality at very low prices second hand. It takes only minor effort to fill the grooves with putty or some kind of filler, and the process is reversible - mine was stolen from my house).

Regards
John

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: bseed(charleskratz)
Date: 07 Apr 99 - 04:18 AM

A bassist whose lines are most assuredly not boring is Missy Raines (also on Rounder, I think). --seed

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Art Thieme
Date: 07 Apr 99 - 11:49 PM

Ah, nothing to fret about folks!

Art

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From:
Date: 08 Apr 99 - 09:50 AM

By the way, I have never heard a fretless guitar that sounded good. They are all too muted. A fretless banjo is also more muted, but the banjo tone can withstand some muting.

On the Vestapol Video "Shady Grove" there is a fretless banjo played by Blanton Owen. He and Mike Seeger accompany Tommy Jarell. His playing is great. His fretless fingerboard is made of formica.

There was a time when all basses were fretless.

By the way, Art, I recently saw the phrase "Throw away your fetters" and I read it as "Throw away your frets".

Murray

Subject: RE: Fretless guitar
From: Art Thieme
Date: 08 Apr 99 - 10:26 AM

Frets are just SPEED BUMPS anyway.