Folk - How many ways can you do it?

Subject: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 24 May 07 - 02:02 AM

The "Collapse of Folk Clubs" thread gave me much to think about.

One of the important points that a number of people made was that although their are less folk clubs as such, much folk music can be heard and the quality, although variable, can be very high.

Another point was that the varieties, formats and opportunities to hear and / or be involved in folk music is much wider than it probably was at the height of the Folk Club era.

Perhaps people would like to add to this list of "Ways we can do it"?

1. A weekly Folk Club with residents, floor singers and guests
2. A Sing around, mostly songs, a chair sort of person, one song each around the room then again until closing
3. A tune session, Instrumentalists play tunes. People join in if they can
4. One off concerts with well known guests
5. Ceilidhs / Barn Dances
6. Morris sides who gather to practice regularly
7. Mummers
8. Maypole Dances and other seasonal events
9. Folk Festivals
10. Folk on TV and radio

I think most of us who run or have run folk clubs and such like events do it so that we can hear the music we like and to sing or play with others. We alo have some kind of mission to bring this music to a wider audience.

Would a mixture of the above work more effectively than the once a week Folk Club?

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: treewind
Date: 24 May 07 - 04:17 AM

"Would a mixture of the above work more effectively than the once a week Folk Club?"

I don't know about a mixture, but it's always nice when there's several activities like that going on regularly in the same locality and they all feel part of the same integrated folk scene, so the morris team are among the resident band and singers at the folk club, the monthly ceilidh is promoted at the folk club and vice versa, both events get a plug in the local radio, the mummers come and entertain at the ceilidh...

There usually is lots of stuff like that going on, but I think maybe not as much cross-promotion as there used to be. Like "parish notices" at folk clubs, or going to a session and dishing out leaflets promoting some concert or other. Is it that many of us have become too specialized?

I've done everything in your list at least once, and continue with several of them regularly. Am I an anachronism?

Anahata

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 24 May 07 - 04:26 AM

No...
Just an "Anahatarism!"
Ralphie

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: treewind
Date: 24 May 07 - 04:55 AM

I read that as "amateurism"...

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Surreysinger
Date: 24 May 07 - 05:30 AM

LOL! Well as long as it wasn't "aneurism", "anabolism" (or indeed even "anorakism" ... inventions are always good !) and there's nothing life-threatening involved ........[grin]

Anahata - in terms of context I don't think you can be said to be an anachronism.... Chambers' definition
= "anything out of keeping with chronology" ... did you intend time to have anything to do with it? or did you mean an "aberration"? (Aren't there some wonderful words in the English language?)

As to the list of things to do - I've either been involved or been to nearly everything on the list locally (except 10 - unless you count watching/listening to stuff) ... although Maypole dancing has not featured on my activities list since I was knee high to a grasshopper, and music sessions don't really feature except sitting around the outskirts at one .... unless you count the use of a deadly (and embarassing) shakey egg???

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Mo the caller
Date: 24 May 07 - 05:45 AM

Time has a lot to do with it.
Not enough days in the week.
Too many years under the bridge (for 5& 6 as a dancer)

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Surreysinger
Date: 24 May 07 - 06:05 AM

Oh dear Mo - that sounds so world weary... re 5 I don't dance (back and other probs), but I love standing at the back and bopping, when I'm not sitting on the box office desk!

Yup - I'll agree to needing more days in the week - anybody got a spare TARDIS???

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 24 May 07 - 06:24 AM

SS..
Do you think we could use Anaglypta?
R x

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Waddon Pete
Date: 24 May 07 - 06:31 AM

The collapse of the folk clubs thread was one I abandoned very early on. Not an edifying spectacle!

More days in the week would be good as long as we didn't recycle Mondays! (If anyone offers to sell you a Tardis, smile sweetly and say you have just spent all your money on buying Nelson's Column!)

I, also, have added my sixpennyworth to the items on the list (with the exception of maypole dancing...unless you count dancing outside a pub called "The Maypole"?)

I don't actually think that there has been a collapse. Folk music has diversified and evolved and I think it does now reach more of the general public than it once did.

Best wishes,

Peter

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 24 May 07 - 06:52 AM

So do I Pete, I suspect that some people who organise events are not as aware as they might be about the range of possible activities and how they might support each other.

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: MikeofNorthumbria
Date: 24 May 07 - 07:02 AM

Les - another variant for your list.

Our Morris side, like many others, includes a fair number of dancers who also sing and/or play instruments. So, when we dance out on Thursday evenings during the summer months, we generally finish with a few tunes and songs in the bar of the last pub on the itinerary. Often the pub's other customers join in as well - but even those who don't generally seem to enjoy the event.

Since we vist a different pub each week during the season, it's difficult to tell whether they could support this kind of event on a weekly or monthly basis. But the landlords (and drinkers) certainly seem happy to welcome us back year after year. So, we have gradually built up a circuit of annual session-cum-singarounds, meeting at a different pub every Thursday night during the summer months.

I'm sure that many other Morris teams around the country are doing the same. It would be difficult to assess the impact of all this activity over the years - but at the least, it provides an opportunity for people outside the committed folk fraternity to hear the music and decide for themselves whether they like it or not.

Wassail!

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 24 May 07 - 07:09 AM

It's a good one Mike, I did it with Gorton Morrismen and loved it all

Cheers

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Surreysinger
Date: 24 May 07 - 07:19 AM

Ralphie - definitely off topic and rather silly - why would we want to use white embossed wallpaper ??? .... [grins]

Reading back over my last post - could I stress that I do not (normally) actually sit ON the box office desk, but AT it whilst at Barn Dances ... more niceties of the English language, I suppose!!

WP - why should I wish to turn down the purchase of a TARDIS - just think what you could achieve with it ( I might even be able to go back and buy all of those LEADER LP's that I never bought in the seventies ... sigh) ... and anyway, I wouldn't be able to store Nelson's Column in the back garden!!!

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: greg stephens
Date: 24 May 07 - 08:18 AM

Les: I've read your list of ten, and can add a few more, from my own musical activities.
Unplanned impromptu singing in pubs.
Unplanned impromptu playing in pubs.
Non-folk festivals: eg maritime, canal, civic, general arts, rock, jazz.
Singing at family gatherings, parties etc.
Events not normally called festivals: eg agricultural dos, county shows, open days at garden centres, organic farms, food fairs etc.
Weddings, christening, funerals.
Teaching workshops(often unassociated with festivals)
Rehearsal groups: eg fiddle ensembles practising, that kind of thing.

Interestingly these sorts of things, surely the bedrock of folk as they represent folk in the community, rather than artificially and hydroponically maintained, do not appear much on the folk radar. A musician could be fully occupied playing folk music professionally full time, for example, and never appear in the Guardian or fRoots or on Mike Harding or whatever, because they are not playing within the folk ring-fence, ghetto, or whatever you care to term it.

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: BanjoRay
Date: 24 May 07 - 09:22 AM

How about camps - not festivals, just places where people camp together for the weekend just to sing and play and dance. You only pay the camping fee, like the Mudcat Yorkshire Gathering which couldn't happen this year. In Foaotmad we'll be having 6 or 7 this year, where 70 or so people will play and swap tunes all weekend. I'm just setting off for one at Sacrewell Farm near Peterborough.
Cheers
Ray

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: GUEST,Nicholas Waller
Date: 24 May 07 - 09:52 AM

A couple of other possibilities, overlapping with what other people have mentoned:

Beer festivals/promotions:
The Topic in Bradford did a one-off one-day Saturday event alongside a beer promotion by its host pub, the Cock and Bottle.

Some villages - Wedmore, for example - have weekend-long real ale festivals and associated music, which might as well be folk as jazz or rock or anything else.

Theatre:
Barry Smith (barrysmithmusic.co.uk/) for one has combined youth theatre and folk; and in my area a year ago there was some kind of locally-touring local-interest amateur-run play that also incorporated folk musicians (David and Issy Emeny I think) but I didn't see it and have lost the bumf.

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: greg stephens
Date: 24 May 07 - 10:08 AM

Nicholas Waller: good choice, theatre. I had forgotten about that, which is odd because that is what I spent half my time working in.Innumerable folkies work in the theatre, both stage based, site specific, community event based, you name it folkies are to be found there. Very interesting thread this.
It is caused me to analyse how I spend my time, and I find that the proportion of work I do that comes into some recognisable "folk scene" activity is probably around 10%. (By folk scene I mean folk festivals, folk clubs, concert circuit, dedicated radio or TV programmes).

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: JennyO
Date: 24 May 07 - 10:54 AM

I have a lot of friends in the local Morris side, Black Joak Morris, many of whom have been regulars at my folk club - North by Northwest Folk Club - over the years. Some of them are also musicians in bands that have performed at North By Northwest. They used to practise on Wednesday nights, but a few months ago, they changed to Thursdays. My folk club is normally a monthly event, on the first Thursday of the month, which you would think might keep them away - except that the first Thursday is the night they dance out, so of course they sometimes dance out at North By Northwest.

They have done that several times, including earlier this month, when we had our "John Howard Memorial Seditious Scribblers Award", a competition to see who could write the most seditious song or poem about little johnnie, our prime miniscule. One of the entries was by one of the Morris men, Ken, who wrote new words to Lads a'Bunchem ("Oh dear mother what a fool I be") which they danced while he sang it.

One of the things which I thought made the night really interesting, was seeing people whom you wouldn't often find in the same room, laughing at each other's songs and poems and all the other antics - a lot of cross-pollination happening.

On most months, we have regular performers who get paid, as well as floor spots - often a pleasant surprise or two there. We have had themed session nights, which have been fun, although they only happen occasionally. Then there are the occasional Sunday afternoon concerts - usually booked events - where a performer is expected to draw a large audience, and we often set the seats up differently to accommodate that. Our biggest audience was probably for Les Barker a couple of years ago. We are actually looking forward to a repeat performance next year when he visits Australia again.

In November we will have been going for 10 years - some nights being better attended than others - but we still have some of our original supporters, as well as a core of regulars and new people popping in, and there is still a lot of enthusiasm, so we must be doing something right! Looking forward to the next 10 years!

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: GUEST
Date: 24 May 07 - 11:23 AM

I've been active in all or most of the activities listed, at one time or another.

What does strike me quite often is how specialised and narrow many of the participants are in their interests - musicians who can't stand singing, singers who don't like tunes, festival-goers who never attend concerts, festival-goers who attend nothing but concerts, dancers who don't want to attempt play or sing, instrumentalists who know all the dance tunes but have never danced, etc.

I mean, it's good that people can dip into whatever they fancy, but if more people would give something else a go sometimes, perhaps the end result would be a more integrated folk scene with a higher profile in the community.

In the meantime, yes, I think a mix of as many of the types of activity as possible would be great, but the only way that happens is when lots of different people get involved, and set up/support the things they're most keen on. For one person or commiteee to attempt to run all or most of the listed activities in their town or area would require superhuman effort and and eight-day week.

So maybe a bit more cross-pollenation is what's required: "parish notices" at clubs, more flyers and posters, more personal pushing - one of the nicest ways to get more involved is when an organiser calls you or e-mails you personally to say when the next club/session is and hopes you'll be there, but it's not very commonly done.

Some areas are lucky enough to have one or two tireless individuals who devote themselves to publicising and promoting local events via websites, e-mail or newsletters. These people (you know who you are) are the unsung heroes - or heroines, Valmai! - of the folk world and I, for one, and enormously grateful to them for their efforts. But to succeed, they need the rest of us to show a bit of interest, support the local folk scene and try something new.

Memo to self: make a bit more effort to get out to local events.

Marje

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Waddon Pete
Date: 24 May 07 - 03:50 PM

Hello,

Cross-pollination! What a lovely phrase to describe what we do! I, too seem to play more outside of folk clubs than within!

Surreysinger...you have got room for Nelson's Column...that little spot by the shed...where the peas were before the pigeons ate them! While having a real Tardis would be wonderful, I fear the seller might be perpetrating a deception!

Best wishes,

Peter

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Surreysinger
Date: 24 May 07 - 07:23 PM

Peter - would that I had room for a shed in my pocket handkerchief back garden - I'm not allowed to grow or put up anything over 6 feet in height in the front ... so I regret that Nelson's Column is never likely to feature in either of my small plots ... and anyway, who needs the pigeons that usually go with it???

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Bee
Date: 24 May 07 - 10:23 PM

Not a huge venue, but there's a campground down the Eastern Shore a ways where the owner hold a nightly campfire down on the rock beach, serves wild mussels, and waives the camping fee for anyone willing to play an instrument and lead some singing. And if the musician has a few CDs with him, he'll put them in the giftshop to sell. It's almost always fun, you meet other campers, hear some good music (usually). Wish other campgrounds would follow suit.

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 25 May 07 - 02:50 AM

Ralphie - wasn't that the little village in 'Fiddler on the roof'?

Huge venues are not always necessary - we've had some quite good sessions in our dining room. Mind you, if all the Lego in it now could be used to build us an extension, it would improve the lot of the first one in when they need to get out again!

LTS

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 25 May 07 - 03:05 AM

Each others houses, how significant is this?

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Bee
Date: 25 May 07 - 09:37 AM

Each other's houses is pretty significant in Nova Scotia - I don't know a musician who got a gig or a career without at some early point having been invited or recommended to play in public by another musician s/he met at someone's house party.

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: GUEST,jus passin by
Date: 25 May 07 - 07:42 PM

I once saw these bumpersnickers at a folk fest:

Folk Musicians do it--
in a traditional way.


    Folkies do it---
       passing it down from generation to generation.


          Folk Musicians do it--
                      uncopyrighted.

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 27 May 07 - 02:08 PM

And seem to enyoy arguing about it!

Subject: RE: Folk - How many ways can you do it?
From: Old Grizzly
Date: 27 May 07 - 06:39 PM

Hi jus passin by,

Totally off thread, but it hit my funnybone,

I once saw a guy on a monster Harley at the traffic lights and his T shirt read :-

"If you can read this, my damn wife has fallen off again "

:o)

Dave