Subject: Traditional songs & madness From: Jane Bird Date: 16 Apr 99 - 10:11 AM I'd like some helping looking for some songs, please. Have you ever come across any traditional songs that take mental ill heath as a theme? Ones I think of off the top of my head (and after looking through the database) are: Cheers, Jane Bird |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Bert Date: 16 Apr 99 - 10:15 AM A search for Bedlam gives you four hits. |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Bert Date: 16 Apr 99 - 10:21 AM Then there's "Come inside" |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Wolfgang Date: 16 Apr 99 - 10:33 AM not traditional, but by a songwriter wit a traditional way of performing: Luka Bloom's (then: Barry Moore) "Jenny of the sung" Wolfgang |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: AndyG Date: 16 Apr 99 - 11:30 AM Sort of depends on your viewpoint, I suppose, but I'd say songs like Crazy Man Michael and that family of songs blaming murder and misdeed on mental factors fit into this category too.
AndyG |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: hotspur Date: 16 Apr 99 - 11:30 AM You could argue for madness as a theme of a lot of the murder ballads, since a lot of the people in them act really insanely! Cf. Lord Randall--I always thought it was bizarre that the mother spends half the ballad asking her dying son what property he's going to leave her. How sane is that? |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Frank of Toledo Date: 16 Apr 99 - 11:34 AM Lunatic Asylum recorded by Rick Lee on Waterbug. In his liner notes Rick says "the basic story is about the Lunatic Asylum, where two patients, while they were in the "asylum", probably Eastern State Lunatic Asylun in Knoxville Tennessee, now called Lakeshore Hospital. They suffered some sort of mental illness or emotional breakdown , sometime around the turn of the century. The song was collected in the field by Tony Cavender of Eastern State Tennessee University around 1974. lyricsa and more background forthcoming is wanted/ |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Barbara Shaw Date: 16 Apr 99 - 11:46 AM Gordon Lightfoot did a beautiful song called: That Same Old Obsession. |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Bruce O. Date: 16 Apr 99 - 05:01 PM In the Scarce Songs 2 file on my website is an 18th century copy of "The Maid in Bedlam", and preceeding it is most of "The Black's Lamentation" [in Bedlam], c 1735-40 on which it was loosely based. www.erols.com/olsonw |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: LEJ Date: 16 Apr 99 - 05:19 PM This thread title strikes me as a fitting description of conversations on the Mudcat |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Barbara Date: 16 Apr 99 - 07:11 PM Hills of Shiloh by Shel Silverstein. An eerie song about a bride waiting for her intended to return from the war. |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Colin The Whistler (inactive) Date: 16 Apr 99 - 10:08 PM Now harm..and excuse this..but some traditional songs, (sean nos..excuse the spelling) just like our mandolin player @ Song The Rock would drive ya to bloody madness Jesus i'm getting wild sarcastic FOR A BELFAST MAN THATS A RARE THING TO SAY !!! Colin Ballygally |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Lucius Date: 16 Apr 99 - 11:05 PM I didn't check the DT, but if Bedlam Boys (Boys of Bedlam) wasn't one of the four hits, it should be. A great Morris dance, and even more fun to sing afterwards. Still I sing bonnie boys, bonnie mad boys, bedlam boys are bonnie....... |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Date: 16 Apr 99 - 11:13 PM LEJ.....words of wisdom!!!!(giggle) Night Owl |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Penny Date: 17 Apr 99 - 04:24 AM Does "Tom O' Bedlam's Song" count? It's singable. |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Susan of DT Date: 17 Apr 99 - 10:30 AM not traditional, but:
Dr. Freud |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Jane Bird Date: 19 Apr 99 - 08:15 AM I am specifically looking for traidional songs, actually, interesting as contemporary songs about mental illness are. I want to look at the way this theme is delt with in folk songs and lore, you see. I've seen Flagcrackers of Craven (a border side from North Yorkshire) dance "Bedlem Boys": it's rather dramatic and very menacing. They're accompanied by a singer who belts the songs out very impressively! Cheers, |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Shack Date: 19 Apr 99 - 12:47 PM A cajun song named "Evangeline" includes the lines, "Bajou Sam from South Lous-i-anne had gam-bol-ing (gambling) in his veins; Evangeline, from the Maritime, slowly going insane. She stands on the top of a hick-o-ry hill, alone in the lightning and thunder, while down on the river, the boat was a-sinking. She watched the Queen go under." |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 02 May 99 - 07:47 PM "Evangeline" is by The Band. I think someone,Canadian Acadian or Lousiana Cajun, has done a version in French. It's the "Maritimes", not the "Maritime". |
Subject: Lyr Add: The Lunatic Asylum^^ From: Charlie Baum Date: 02 May 99 - 11:04 PM The Lunatic Asylum song noted above, recorded by Rick Lee on his recent CD "There's Talk About A Fence".
The Lunatic Asylum
© 1982 Tennessee Folk Heritage/Tennessee Folklore Society |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Charlie Baum Date: 03 May 99 - 12:09 PM Jane-- Notes about the Tennessee Lunatic Asylum song (above): "This song was collected in the field by Tony Cavender of the ETSU Sociology/Anthropology Department in 1974 when he was interviewing the late Mrs. E. B. of Limestone, Washington County, Tennessee concerning a variety of subjects including midwifery. "Tony Cavender and I [Richard Blaustein] published an article about the song -- Richard Blaustein and Anthony P. Cavender, 'The Lunatic Asylum: Folksong As Healing Process?', Tennessee Folklore Society Bulletin, vol. XLV, no. 1, March 1979. and the field recording itself was issued on an LP edited by Charles K. Wolfe for the Tennessee Folklore Society, 'Tennessee: The Folk Heritage, Vol.2, The Mountains,' TFS 103, 1982, which was nominated for a Grammy in the Traditional Folk Music category in 1982. "We did not refer to Mrs. B. by her full name in either the article or album notes but instead called her 'Mrs. E. B.' to preserve her anonymity and protect her family from any embarrassment because of the theme of insanity in the song. "The basic story about the 'Lunatic Asylum' is that Mrs. E. B.'s aunt apparently composed the song with another patient while they were in what was then called a 'lunatic asylum,' probably Eastern State Lunatic Asylum in Knoxville, now called Lakeshore Hospital. Mrs. B's aunt suffered some sort of mental illness or emotional breakdown after her husband was killed in a train wreck returning from military service sometime around the turn of this century. "Apparently Mrs. B. learned the song after hearing her aunt sing it at family singing sessions; they would get together on Sundays after church and have singing sessions at home. After so many years, Mrs. B. was understandably vague about names, places and dates." -- RB Perhaps the Folklore Society Bulletin article might be of use to you. --Charlie Baum |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Matthew B. Date: 03 May 99 - 02:26 PM Kewl stuff about those asylums. As for contemporary stuff, have you ever considered Donovan's When You're Strange? |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Charlie Baum Date: 03 May 99 - 03:18 PM On a contemporary note, there are the songs on the first album of folk singer-songwriter Dory Previn, circa 1969 or 1970. She had been the wife of Andre Previn, and when he dumped her for Mia Farrow, she had a "nervous breakdown." The songs she wrote as part of her therapy, including "Mr. Whisper," are some of the most amazing first-hand depictions of a descent into madness I've ever heard. --Charlie Baum |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Sandy Paton Date: 03 May 99 - 06:40 PM Jane: I recorded a version of "Black Jack Davy" (Child #200) from Frank Proffitt in northwestern North Carolina back in 1961 that might be of interest to you. He learned the song from his aunt, Nancy Prather, who called it "Gyps of David," and, with his dedication to his tradition, Frank kept it that way. In this version, after the "good man" tracks down his wife, who has run off with the "Gyps of David," he asks her: "Will you return to the gold I have? Will you return to your baby?" "No, never will I leave the arms, The arms of the Gyps of David, The arms of the Gyps of David." This leads into the final verse, which I believe to be unique in the tradition: He jumped into the waters wide, In madness he was raving, And floated off down to the sea Because of the Gyps of David, Because of the Gyps of David. You can find this version on Folk-Legacy's very first release, now available as a custom cassette: Frank Proffitt, of Reese, North Carolina - C-1. Sandy |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Jane Bird Date: 06 May 99 - 06:58 AM The asylum song which Charlie Baum turned up is facinating. Thanks for that. As for "Black Jack Davy", I never come across that version before. Thanks also! Any other traditional songs about mental illness out there? Cheers, |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: ddw in windsor Date: 06 May 99 - 08:57 PM Jane, are you considering things about psychopaths? If so, you might consider Sam Hall (words in the DT), a convicted murderer who doesn't seem to have any remorse. Of course, he never tells us WHY he killed -- maybe he had good reason and was willing to take the consequences. Just a thought....l ddw |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Susan A-R Date: 06 May 99 - 10:36 PM Seems to me that Ewan McCall did one about having a mad wife. Here's a pretty phonetic snippet from my memory (haven't heard it in about 17 years). Anyway, here goes Oh my wife she is humpy she's lumpy My wife she is crazy she's cracked ??? Her tongue it goes clickity clack Tae me ingting tae me ingting tae me ido tae me ingting tae me ingting tae me iday Tae me robobo robobo randy Me Lubstone keeps babin' away In the end I believe that he drowns his wife It ends with something like I dipped her three times in the river and carelessly bade her good day. Ring any bells for anyone else out there?? Susan |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Sandy Paton Date: 07 May 99 - 12:45 AM Yeah, but in my mind's ear it's not MacColl singing, but Tommy Makem. Early Clancy Brothers/Tommy Makem recording? Sandy |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Bob Landry Date: 07 May 99 - 03:00 PM Shack. If you can get it at your local library, check out the Henry Wordsworth Longfellow poem "Evangeline". You'll find out why she might have been going mad. Susan A-R - check out The Cobbler by Tommy Makem. That's where those lines come from. The lyrics and music can be found in a Clancy Brothers book (small format, green cover) published, I think, in the 1970's. I have a copy at home. Bob |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Bert Date: 07 May 99 - 04:05 PM "The ID goes marching on" by Melanie |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: GUEST Date: 06 Sep 14 - 03:38 AM Through Moorfields. |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: GUEST Date: 06 Sep 14 - 04:07 AM Spencer the Rover is said by some to be about a wanderer who has had some kind of mental collapse. Having studied workhouse vagrancy these people were common, expecially homeless soldiers back from war campaigns. Contemporary songs might include The Dutchman, and Reg Meuross new song about Alzheimers, brian Dewhurst was the man who found the song Boys of Bedlam as adopted by Steeleye Span, crazy man michael is not a traditional song. |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Jack Blandiver Date: 06 Sep 14 - 04:16 AM By the title, I thought this was another 1954 thread... |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Jack Campin Date: 06 Sep 14 - 08:43 AM Here's a Scottish one. Crazy Jane The tune is "Fy gar rub her o'er with stra". |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: GUEST,Rahere Date: 06 Sep 14 - 02:38 PM One of the best versions of Bedlam Boys was done by the Cecil Sharp House Choir, Sally Davies arranged it in a fine round in the chorus - but CSH won't allow her to record anything, which is more than just a pity. I would also suggest that if you don't take Long Lankin as possession, then it must be about psychopathic madness. You could also probably treat the entire ghost corpus as displaced grief, verging on schizophrenia. |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Jack Campin Date: 06 Sep 14 - 03:23 PM Nobody's mentioned "My lodging is on the cold ground" yet. From other languages than English: there are poems embedded in the Irish story of Mad King Sweeney which are probably singable, though I don't know of anybody doing it. and there are a lot of songs in several Middle Eastern languages about Majnun driven mad by his love for Laila. I'm more familiar with the Turkish ones (Leila and Mecnun). This one by Asik Veysel has been covered by lots of people: Veysel Ruhi Su (probably more listenable for most) Norse songs about berserking? Malay songs about going amok? |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Steve Gardham Date: 06 Sep 14 - 03:48 PM The OP request was 15 years ago. She's probably moved on by now. But if not there are at least half a dozen Child Ballads that have one of the main characters 'running brain' at the end, though I should add most of these flowed through the pen of Peter Buchan who had his own stock of commonplaces which he used freely. There is a concordance at the back of Vol 5 which should flag these up. If not there is an online concordance somewhere out there. There are dozens of Bedlam songs. The simplest place to find them would be on the Bodleian Ballads website. |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: GUEST Date: 06 Sep 14 - 08:03 PM The OP request was 15 years ago. She's probably moved on by now. love how they pop back up!!! there was an old woman lived under the hill weel ah weelah wye ah...makem&clancys 7& |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Tattie Bogle Date: 06 Sep 14 - 08:22 PM Ok, well....15 years on....the song Susan A-R asked about is Dick Darby the Cobbler: words in the DT. And it was sung by The Clancys and Tommy Makem, and scores of other people! |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: MGM·Lion Date: 07 Sep 14 - 04:03 AM Actually, Tattie B & Susan A-R, it was only sung, solo, by Tommy Makem. When he sang it as part of the 'Clancy Brothers and Tommy Makem' act, the rest of them would retire to the back of the stage to give him the spotlight spot. It's on Youtube. There is also an informative ongoing thread on here, called "Dick Darby the Cobbler: songs with same tune", which I have refreshed as part of this discussion. ≈M≈ |
Subject: RE: Traditional songs & madness From: Steve Gardham Date: 07 Sep 14 - 01:15 PM This old woman who lived under a hill was originally a duke's young daughter who became pregnant to her father's clerk, had 2 babies born in secret and murdered them, fearful for being cast out on the streets by her father. Presumably already driven out of her mind by then she sees the spirits of her 2 babies who condemn her into Hell. |
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