Origins: inis dhun ramha

Subject: Origins: Inis Dhun Ramha
From: GUEST,Jiggers
Date: 17 Feb 08 - 06:56 PM

Hi,

This might be a long shot but .....

does anyone know anything about the Irish song 'Inis Dhun Ramha'.

I have both the lyrics and an English translation. What I am after is any background information e.g. how old is it, when was it first written down, is the Island mythical or existing, or another name for an existing Island. That kind of thing.

Here are the things I already know

Sung by Altan, Na Fili, Bill Jone (simplified English translation )
Diarmuid and Grainne - reference to the Celtic legend the pursuit of Diarmuid and Grainne
Iorras - a place in Co. Sligo

Any help appreciated. Lyrics in Irish and English below


'Rí na cruinne gan mé 's tú i n-Iorras
Nó thiar in Inis Dhún Rámha
Ar Bhruach na Finne le taobh na tuinne
Ag Féachaint loingis thar sáile
Dá mhéid ár dtuirse 's gan aoineach againn
Ach geag an duilliúr ár sábhail
'Sé deirfeadh gach duine gur lách ár n-imeacht
Mar d'éalaigh Diarmuid le Gráinne

Aréir go bhfaca mé féin in m'aisling
Mar bheadh sí ar bhácan mo láimhe
'N spéirbhean mhaiseach mar aon-bhrat sneachta
Dá mbíodh gan caisgairt a dhéanamh
Taobh na macnaidhe da mbíodh in m'aice
Mar chéile leála gan airnéis
S' é béilín meala a leigheasadh mo ghalar
'S a bhéarfadh mó cholann 'un sláinte

Dá mbínn mo bharrún ní dhéanfainn dabhar
Ar spré bó capall nó caorach
Dá bhfaghainn-sé 'n ainnir 'na suí le m'aice
Nó í 'na seasamh go h-aerach
Tá gné ar a craiceann míl' uair níos taithmhaigh
Ná írigh mhaiseach na gréine
'S ní breag a chanaim ach is fíor a n-abraim
Gurab í thug mais' ar gach maighdean

English Translation :

King of the universe, that we're not in Iorras
Or over in Inis Dhún Rámha
On the banks of the Finn, close by the waves
Watching big ships go sailing the ocean
Though weary and tired with no one to cheer us
But the leafy branches to shade us
And people would fondly compare our going
To the elopment of Diarmad and Gráinne

Last night she appeared to me in my dreaming
Like I held her in the fold of my arm
This maiden so comely like a blanket of snow
If it were to refrain from thawing
Pride of mankind were she by my side
As bed-pal without any dowry
Her honey-sweet lips would sure my affliction
And ensure my sick body's recovery

If I were a baron, I wouldn't be craving
For horses or kine as a dowry
If I had this maiden to sit down beside me
Or stand there so stately and cheery
The sheen in her skin is far more endearing
Than the rays of the sun at the dawning
It's no lie to relate, but the truth here I state
That she is the fairest of maidens


John

Subject: RE: Origins: inis dhun ramha
From: GUEST,Bobby Bob, Ellan Vannin
Date: 18 Feb 08 - 10:24 AM

I know the song from Tomas O Canainn's singing of it on the Na Fili album.

Iorras is the Irish name which is Anglicised as Erris, which is in County Mayo up Belmullet way, so assume the song is from the Gaeltacht on that coast. There may be other places called Iorras/Erris, but that's the one I know of.

I couldn't spot an island called Inis Dun Ramha, but the name would mean the Isle of the Thick Fort or something like that.


Lhiats,

Bobby Bob

Subject: RE: Origins: inis dhun ramha
From: GUEST,Jiggers
Date: 22 Feb 08 - 01:28 PM

Hi Bobby,

thanks for the repsonse - the only one !

Jiggers

Subject: RE: Origins: inis dhun ramha
From: Geoff Wallis
Date: 22 Feb 08 - 03:03 PM

I reckon this is one of those songs which either owes much to poetic licence or has simply been corrupted over the ages.

Apart from the Altan version, which Mairéad says she got from her late father Francie, there are two other recorded Donegal versions in Irish. The first is by Albert Fry (Belfast-born, but with strong Donegal connections) and the second by Caitlín Ní Dhomhnaill from Rannafast in The Rosses. Both versions were available on cassette from Cló Iar-Chonnachta (www.cic.ie).

As for geography, I don't think this song has anything to do with Mayo. The River Finn is in Donegal and meets the River Mourne south of Strabane. There is no River Finn in Mayo. Iorras is the Irish version of Erris in Mayo, but also of Urris in Inishowen.

That being said, there's no possibility that anyone could have stood on the banks of the Finn and 'been close to the waves' or watched big ships sailing into the ocean.

The Diarmúid and Gráinne reference is clearly a metaphor for emigration.

Lastly, 'rámha' does not mean 'thick'. The song's title loosely translates as 'island fort of the oars'. The island in question is impossible to identify.

I hope that helps, though it doesn't get you much further.