Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: JedMarum
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 03:52 PM

I'd be happy to perform for George Bush.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: irishenglish
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 03:40 PM

To my moral compass, it's indefensible for Gavin to entertain at the White House. I wouldn't have played for Clinton, and certainly not for the current Resident (not that they'd ask me).

That's having it both ways-he shouldn't have played at the WHITE HOUSE, and not for Bush. So which is it-no one should ever play at the white house, or just this particular one? Is this another music and politics thread, or just a condemnation of a man you don't know? My point was not that you actually could call the man, but that it is unfair of you to vehemently condemn the man without knowing his own reasons for playing there, and then, copping out by holding onto your De Dannan records while telling him to fuck off.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: michaelr
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 03:22 PM

Well, I happen to have misplaced Gavin's phone number, so please ask him for me. And it's not about playing for "a" president but this one.

As concerns Paul Robeson, ABCD makes a good point when he says that Stalin's atrocities may not have been widely known in the US at the time PR was eulogizing him.

I think I'll keep my De Dannan vinyl records, but I certainly won't be buying any of Gavin's future products.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: GUEST,The Mole Catcher's unplugged Apprentice
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 01:42 PM

Oh...and will you be breaking all your De Dannan CD's/ records in protest? (if you own any)

Charlotte (the view from Ma and Pa's piano stool)

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: GUEST,The Mole Catcher's unplugged Apprentice
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 01:35 PM

"or even address, my point."

what infernal drivel.

There I addressed your point

Charlotte (the view from Ma and Pa's piano stool)

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 11:21 AM

Thanks for the Robeson text. On seeing it at first, I initially expected something quite different (i.e., PR expressing disillusionment at learning the darker truths of Stalin's rule). I think it was Orwell who, in the 1930s, was scornful of those who felt compelled to support everything said or done in the USSR simply because they agreed with some of the work of Lenin, Stalin et al. In addition to the musical/cultural emphasis of Robeson's words, there's certainly significance in what he writes about "empty promises" made to black people in USA, and the typical attitude of cultural/racial superiority he mentions. Before Khruschev's denunciation of Stalin, how much was generally known of the truth about the Stalinist regime? Or was PR perhaps thinking that, in the long, long run, a Soviet approach was better "for the greatest happiness of the greatest number" than the Free Market Economics of the "West"? I don't know; but I've always regarded Paul Robeson as a truly great person, and certainly would not condemn him for the terms of his praises here.

With regard to modern-day performers refusing to perform for certain people, well, it all depends on what you consider of primary importance. Bush is easy amused; Krusty the Klown seems a more appropriate invitation.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: irishenglish
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 10:37 AM

Perhaps you should ask Frankie rather than condemming first. When Martin Carthy received his MBE (I believe it was that, or OBE? feel free to correct me) he said he wrestled with the decision. Should he take it as an honor purely, should he say hell no and not take praise from the monarchy? I believe in the end what he said was, he was accepting it for all the people before him-the Sam Larner's, and Fred Jordan's, etc. I agree with the above post that he might have just done it to say he played for a President, and if you do that michaelr, you might find that you need to condemn an inordinate number of performers, folk and non folk alike who have played for a President, or a Prime Minister, or what have you. I'm sure Frankie had his own reasons for doing it, so you have no right to condemn him unless you know that reason.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: MartinRyan
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 04:54 AM

Michaelr

Can I take it you would condemn Paul Robeson in the same vitriolic terms, then?

Regards

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: michaelr
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 12:49 AM

Calling me names does not invalidate, or even address, my point.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: katlaughing
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 12:47 AM

Not a troll, Gulliver, just very angry folk.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: Gulliver
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 11:43 PM

Ah, I see, a troll. Well, I'm out of here...

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: michaelr
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 11:00 PM

I don't give a shit who was present. To my moral compass, it's indefensible for Gavin to entertain at the White House. I wouldn't have played for Clinton, and certainly not for the current Resident (not that they'd ask me).

My language is an expression of the depth of my anger, Gulliver. If you can't stomach straight talk, maybe you should be elsewhere. The Mudcat is a bastion of free speech -- I posted the same at thesession.org, and it was quickly deleted. No such censorship here.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: Gulliver
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 10:51 PM

Michaelr, there's no need for that kind of language here. If you can't express yourself in acceptable English then go somewhere else.

And check your facts. According to the Irish Independent there were representatives of both sides of the still tense political set-up in the North of Ireland, present, as described here :

US president George Bush will give over half his day to a small, neutral country on the edge of Europe. He will accept a crystal bowl of herbs from the head of this country and meet with other leaders from both sides of its borders.

After that, the entourage heads off to Capitol Hill, where a lunch will be hosted by the speaker of the house of representatives, Nancy Pelosi.

Mr Bush and Speaker Pelosi don't get along, so the chemistry between them will be captivating.

But the presence of Taoiseach Bertie Ahern, the North's deputy first minister Martin McGuinness and junior minister Jeffrey Donaldson, means the pair will keep up appearances and smile as they listen to the fiddler Frankie Gavin entertaining the gathering.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: Jack Campin
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 07:11 PM

Do we have Frankie's set list for the occasion?

Including "The Little Pig's Lament for the Empty Trough", maybe?

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: GUEST,Terp
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 06:39 PM

Say it ain' so, Frankie!

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: Ernest
Date: 17 Mar 08 - 08:21 AM

Bravo, Martin!

Regards
Ernest

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: MartinRyan
Date: 17 Mar 08 - 06:03 AM

Let's keep a sense of perspective:
Click here.

Regards

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: Folkiedave
Date: 17 Mar 08 - 05:25 AM

How many folkies will get to say, before they die, that they played a gig at the White House?

The Glenrock Carolers turned down an invitation to the White House one Christmas and they are American and about two hours drive away.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: michaelr
Date: 17 Mar 08 - 01:24 AM

The office has become irreparably tainted by the man. (not the first man, but certainly the worst.) Any musician who takes that gig is by association stained with blood.

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: Amos
Date: 16 Mar 08 - 07:59 PM

Aww, Michael, come on now. Tell us what you really feel about it....,

Seriously though, it is not the man but the office. Hwo many folkies will get to say, before they die, that they played a gig at the White House?

(Not that I don't deeply sympthize with your senitments).


A

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Mar 08 - 07:55 PM

Of course it might depend what they play and sing...

Subject: RE: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: Sorcha
Date: 16 Mar 08 - 07:51 PM

I won't go quite that far, but I am dissapointed. Didn't know he'd left DeDannan either.....

Subject: Frankie Gavin plays for George Bush
From: michaelr
Date: 16 Mar 08 - 06:54 PM

From Ramblinghouse: "Frankie Gavin will play in the White House for George W and friends on St Patrick's Day. The former De Danann fiddle player will be joined by singer Michelle Lally, Eric Cunningham on bodhrán, and guitarist Joe Fallon."

FUCK HIM AND THE HORSE HE RODE IN ON! Gavin has just lost what respect I had for him as a musician. Fuck you, Frank. With a two-by-four.

Disgustedly,
Michael