Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie

Subject: Review: Bonnie Jeannie O' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Barry Finn
Date: 02 Jun 08 - 06:32 PM

I've known of this song for a very long time but never took it up. Now I'm going about my business singing the few verse of it I can remember. Well for the past couple of weeks it's been haunting me & for no good reason other than it's a great song. I haven't heard it in a while & haven't run across anything that's brought it to he forefront of my mind. So I can only say that it's gonna haunt me till I learn it. I like iDick Gaughan's version in the DT but I'n not Dick & I don't sound like Dick & my speech isn't at all Scottish sound like Dick, plus some of the words in his version I don't understand. So I'm not keen on doing what he does but I would be keen on something close to it. I can't understand alot of what Dick sings unless I slow him down (sometimes that would mean putting him in reverse) or listen to him a few times over, which I find is not a bad thing to do at all. Any suggestions?
Another question, I searched & surprizingly found no discussions about this song, history, origins if there's any fact & why are both or whatever, so if anyone can add more to it would they please do so.
Though some versions have the last names different in most one or the other is a Gordon, what's up with that?

Barry

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie O' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 02 Jun 08 - 06:46 PM

I always loved this song, and first heard Gordeanna McCulloch sing it (beautifully) on one of The Clutha's albums. Try to hunt it down and give it a listen if you haven't heard it. I seem to recall that on the album they called it "Glenlogie" though her words are closer to Dick Gaughan's than to the Glenlogie in the DT (I remember the nine and nine maidens). Unfortunately this was an LP and not a CD so I have no way of playing it now to refresh my memory and (ha!) help out with the words.

Can't answer any of the historical questions but I'll watch this thread with interest - somebody's bound to know.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie O' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: van lingle
Date: 02 Jun 08 - 07:56 PM

Great song. Jim Malcolm plays and sings this beautifully on a youtube vid of somewhat mediocre quality. John Strachan did an accapella version that you can hear at Rhapsody.com and it might be more decipherable than Gaughan's.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie O' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: van lingle
Date: 02 Jun 08 - 07:58 PM

And that wasn't meant to slight DG. His was the first version I heard of it and it is awesome.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie O' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: michaelr
Date: 02 Jun 08 - 08:40 PM

This is from the singing of Danny Carnahan.

Glenlogie   


There were four and twenty nobles rode through Bantry fair
And bonny Glenlogie was the flower of them there
There were nine and nine ladies sat in the king's hall
And Jeanie of Bethelmy was the flower of them all

There were four and twenty nobles stood in the king's hall
And bonny Glenlogie was the flower of them all
Down come Jeanie Gordon, come tripping down the stair
And she's chosen Glenlogie among all that were there

Glenlogie, oh Glenlogie, oh will you prove kind
There's a maid's love laid on you, and I've told you my mind
But he's turned away lightly as the Logies do all
Saying, I thank you, Jeanie Gordon, but I'm promised awa'

She's called for her maidens to make up her bed
With ribbons and napkins for to tie up her head
But in comes her father and a wise man was he
Saying, I'll wed you to Drumfendrick (?) who has more gold than he

Oh hold your tongue, father, that never can be
If I'll not have Glenlogie the I surely will die
But her father's own chaplain, a man of great skill
He's written a letter and he's tempered it well:

A pox on you, Logie, why must it be so
There's a maid's love laid on you, must she die in her woe
And a pox on you, Logie, do you think it is kind
There's a maid's love laid on you, must she die in her prime?

When Glenlogie got the letter he was among men
Oh dear me, says Glenlogie, what's the young woman mean?
And when he got the letter a light laugh gave he
But as he read o'er it sure a tear filled his eye

Oh saddle me the black horse and saddle me the brown
Or Jeanie of Bethelmy will be dead ere I'm gone
But the horses were not saddled nor set out on the green
Before bonny Glenlogie he was three miles away


Oh pale and wan was she when Glenlogie came in
But red and rosy grew she when she knew it was him
Where lies your pain, lady, does it lie in your side
Where lies your pain, lady, does it lie in your head?

Oh no, no Glenlogie, you're far from the part
For the pain I lie under sure it lies in my heart
Then come down, Jeanie Gordon, come down by my side
And I'll be the bridegroom and you'll be the bride

Oh Jeanie was married and her dowry was told
When Jeanie of Bethelmy was but sixteen years old
Oh Bethelmy, oh Bethelmy, you shine where you stand
And the heather bells all `round you shine out o'er your lands

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie O' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 02 Jun 08 - 10:34 PM

Carnahan learned the song from Gaughan, and 'translated much of the Scots idiom into more standard English' (his words). There may be some slight mishearings in Michael's transcription: Bantry ought to be Banchory, for example.

For Gaughan's transcription from his own singing and some comments on source and modifications, see  http://www.dickgaughan.co.uk/songs/texts/glenlogi.html

A list of print and recorded sources from tradition can be seen in the Roud Folk Song Index. Run a search for Roud number 101.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie O' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Barry Finn
Date: 03 Jun 08 - 01:40 AM

Thanks all, & thanks for the link Malclom (I couldn't find any text but I don't know if it's me or that there's just the info on that page that comes up).

I found in Danny's 7th verse; "'Oh dear me', says Glenlogie", translation a bit hard to swallow with a straight face but he probably sings it with a bit more passion & seriousness than how I'd read it with my off sense of what's comical.

I know there's the earliest version (1768) is in the Percy Collection (364) & that there's 9 texts in Child (238), 21 texts in Bronson (238), Roud (101) & a Law's & an Ord version but I can't seem to find a way to access any of the ballad sheets from any of the sights. I don't do well with searching, any help here would be really appreciated.
Most of what I've searched & can come up with is pretty much the same text as what's already been posted above. I sure there must be other different texts out there but I just can't get at them.

Thanks again
Barry

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie O' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Barry Finn
Date: 03 Jun 08 - 02:15 AM

I did just find another site that has a 8 versions plus notes, here at the The English and Scottish Popular Ballads site song #238 on page #338.
Still to me it seems unusual that in all the versions the story line & texts are so close & don't differ all that much, even in the wording.

Barry

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie O' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Jun 08 - 02:15 AM

This is the text of John Strachan's version from the Folk Song of Britain series.
The note to it is the most comprehensive I could find. In one of the versions quoted above, the action seems to have been transfered from Scotland to Ireland by substituting Bantry for Banchory, but I'm sure it was a slip as it has never been found here.
It was included on the 3 Folkways albums of Child Ballads made by MacColl which were my introduction to the ballads - still my favourite version by far.
Jim Carroll

Te note to it is the most comprehensive one I could find
1. GLENLOGIE (Child 238), sung by John Strachan, Fyvie, Aberdeenshire; recorded by Alan Lomax and Hamish Henderson.

[Popular recently in the bothies of the Northeast, this ballad brings to light one of the pleasant moments in the reign of Mary, Queen of Scots. On her progress] through the North, she stopped for a time at the house of Fetternear and there took a fancy to a young girl of the neighbourhood named Jean Meldrum, and made her a member of her cortege. One day, on their way through the village of Banchory, Jean's eye fell upon Sir George Gordon. She was smitten and at once wrote him a letter saying that she must have him or die. In one ballad version Sir George voices a perplexity common to many men...

Then reading the letter.
As he stood on the green.
Says, "I leave you to judge, sirs,
What do women mean ?"

At first the knight took the whole affair as a joke, but Jean fell into a violent fever and her father, a chaplain, intervened on her behalf, so skilfully, indeed, that the knight relented and married her. At this time Jean was barely sixteen years old.

References:
Christie I, p. 282; Moffat MS, p. 239; Greig LL, pp. 190-2; Ord, pp. 412-5.

1. There were four and twenty nobles stood at the king's ha'.
And bonny Glenlogie was floor o' them a'.

2. There were nine and nine nobles rode roon' Banchory Fair
And bonny Glenlogie was floor o' them there.

3. Doon come Jeannie Gordon, she come trippin' doonstairs.
And she's fa'en in love with Glenlogie over a' that was there.

4. She called on his footboy that stood by his side,
"Now who is that young man and far does he bide?"

5. "His name is Glenlogie when he is at hame,
And he's o' the Gay Gordons, and his name is Lord John."

6. "Glenlogie, Glenlogie, you'll be constant and kind,
I've laid my love on you and you're aye in my mind."

7. He turned him roon' quickly as the Gordons do a',
Says, "I thank you, Jeannie Gordon, but your tocher's ower sma'."

8. Her father was a chaplain and a man o' great skill.
And he penned a brave letter and he penned it richt weel.

9. When he looked on the letter a light laugh laughed he,
But when he read the letter the tear blind his e'e.

10. "Go saddle the black horse and saddle the broon.
Bonny Jean o' Bethalnie'll be dead ere I win."

11.   An' pale and wan was she when Glenlogie come in,
But reid and rosy grew she when she kent it was him.

12. Oh, Bethalnie, oh, Bethalnie, it shines where it stands;
And the heather bells o'er it shines o'er Fyvie's land.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: GUEST,Simon Tough
Date: 09 Dec 16 - 07:28 PM

Bethelnie is a place 5 miles from where I live and Banchory and Fyvie also close by,facinating hearing a folk song from the area......guy on Facebook Jamie Crawford McLaren Marshall does a version that's outstanding

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: JHW
Date: 10 Dec 16 - 05:09 PM

Straight away I remembered Margie Sinclair singing it way back with Mirk and found Springthyme Records site where they still have the old cassette but also vinyl.
Can't play either in the car these days but I shall order a vinyl as my cassette has gone the way of most factory recorded casettes and only 'plays' with extreme wow.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: GUEST,RA
Date: 11 Dec 16 - 05:44 AM

Guest Simon Tough - there are MANY songs from your general area of the world! For example, 'The Mill o' Tifty's Annie' (also known as 'Andrew Lammie')... and 'Rhynie'... 'The Tarves Rant'... 'The Bonnie Lass o' Fyvie'... etc. Take a look in the Greig Duncan Folk Song Collection or 'Ord's Bothy Songs and Ballads' for more.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Dec 16 - 06:29 AM

Bonny Udny - check out Iona Fyfe singing it on youtube. In fact, everybody should check out Iona Fyfe, from Huntly in Aberdeenshire. Great voice, 17 or 18 years old, and she sings a lot of songs pertaining to North East Scotland.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: BobKnight
Date: 11 Dec 16 - 05:18 PM

Guest above was me - didn't notice I had become disconnected/logged out. Bob

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: GUEST,RA
Date: 11 Dec 16 - 05:47 PM

Yes! Then there's all the other great singers from up that way that Simon Tough might like to know about if he doesn't already - Lizzie Higgins, Jeannie Robertson, Stanley Robertson, Lucy Stewart, Elizabeth Stewart, John Strachan, etc. More songs... 'Johnny o' Braidislea' is around Monymusk. Then Huntly-wise there is of course 'Bogie's Bonnie Belle'. And too many more songs to mention. As someone from a different part of Scotland, I'm always amazed at how rich the north-east song tradition seems... long may it thrive!

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 12 Dec 16 - 09:01 AM

Hear, hear!
And adding to the list of (still alive) bothy balladeers and singers of songs from around that area, Jock Duncan, Shona Donaldson, Hector Riddell, Geordie Murison, Joe Aitken, Jim and Kate Taylor, Allan Taylor, Russell ?, Ian Russell, Danny Couper.
When my parents were alive, they used to live in Ellon, and a drive around the countryside there meant another song place name around every corner!
And going up a bit further into the north-east corner, you'll find Mormond Braes, Farewell tae Tarwathie, The Bonnie Ship the Diamond, Macpherson's Farewell, etc.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: GUEST,Guest DP
Date: 19 Mar 17 - 06:57 PM

I remember 'Glenlogie' from a double-album sampler I had when I was at school - around 1971 - sung by Shirley and Dolly Collins. It made a great impression on me and even after all this time, I could remember a lot of the words, though the album is long gone. Only now I think to search the internet and fill in the blanks. When I go into work tomorrow, I will print the lyrics off and add it to my repertoire properly.

I wonder if others came across this sampler album way back when and have forgotten it..... You can find the lyrics on 'Mainly Norfolk' although they are not quite as I recall them

Dickon

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: BobKnight
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 05:38 AM

Hay Tattie Bogle (Trish) Ye forgot tae mention me. ha ha. :) And that Russell whose surname you couldn't remember is probably Russell Taylor. Better known for his bothy ballad singing.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Gutcher
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 08:33 AM

For those of you with time on their hands a read of the Spalding Clubs history of Aberdeenshire [MDCCC XLIII] gives some information on this ballad. Please do not ask me on which page of the some 700 pages this information is to be found, from memory the, now suppressed, parish of MELDRUM

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Gutcher
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 08:56 AM

gremlins at work

MELDRUM alias BETHELNIE at the time of M.Q.S. was owned by a William Seton [Mary Seton, the Queens Marys?] and was visited by the Queen when she toured that area. A read of this volume will give some a chance to brush up on their latin as some of the charters are in that tongue.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 10:30 AM

Oops, sorry, Bob! How could I forget you? And yes, it was Russell Taylor I was thinking of.

Subject: RE: Review: Bonnie Jeannie o' Bethelnie/Glenlogie
From: Gutcher
Date: 20 Mar 17 - 11:14 AM

PS.

Somewhere towards the end of the said volume can be found the contemporary details of the burning of CORGAFF castle by Edom o Gordons men--not TOWIE as given in later more modern details of the ballad of EoG.

Two named men were hung at the cross of Stirling,shortly after the dreadfull events portrayed in the ballad of EoG., their crime, composing ballads liable to sow dissension among noblemen.