Mike Harding Show - I've lost it

Subject: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: GUEST,Pete Sumner
Date: 17 Jul 08 - 10:28 PM

The BBC have made some changes...I must have been having a nap.,..I've lost Mike Harding's show....
I am bereft...
:-)
HELP, where is it on my computer....

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: GUEST,Seaking (at sea)
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 01:07 AM

Here ?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio2/r2music/folk/


Sorry, can't do the clicky thing

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 02:55 AM

I have lost the will to live.

eric

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Splott Man
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 03:40 AM

It moved to 7 o'clock a few months ago.

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Bryn Pugh
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 04:48 AM

Jim Moray was this week's guest.

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: nager
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 05:44 AM

The show has gone missing from the BBC's Folk and Country Internet site along with Frank Hennessey's Celtic Heartbeat - my two favourite shows. So for people like me from the other side of the world we can't hear them via the Net... Anyone shed any light on this? Sent email to BBC but no reply yet. Tried the link (above) which took me to the Radio Two site but it says the audio stream is "unavailable at this time". What's happening over there?

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 05:59 AM

It seems to be due to technical hitches because they are installing new software and making changes to the iPlayer, and these are supposedly just teething troubles. The BBC have indicated that their intention is not to bar non-UK listeners from the radio waves. There's an informative thread on the BBC forum, and their moderator is trying to find out more info and keep the board informed. The thread is here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/mbradio2/F2142825?thread=5660968

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: nager
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 06:03 AM

Hi Bonnie.. thanks for that. I have taken a quick look and will wait a few more days to see what happens. Thanks again, fingers crossed, here in NSW, Oz... Paul

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 06:03 AM

Looks like there's still no joy. Maybe everyone should try writing the Beeb directly and complaining - that should get their attention. Link here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/complaints/

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: nager
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 06:10 AM

Thanks again Bonnie.. have submitted the complaint and urge others to do the same as it is a great show.

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Leadfingers
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 06:20 AM

Cant remember which night , but I have caught the M H show on World Sevice , 3 am UK time !

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Folkiedave
Date: 18 Jul 08 - 11:06 AM

I think it is prejudice against the popularity of folk music. My own radio show "Thank Goodness It's Folk (see permathread) is having problems.

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: nager
Date: 19 Jul 08 - 01:31 AM

Mike's show is back on the Net... listened to it this morning online on the Radio 2 site. Frank Hennessey's brilliant show from BBC Wales is online again too. Phew!!!

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Folkiedave
Date: 19 Jul 08 - 06:14 AM

I wonder if the BBC engineers would come and sort Sheffield Live out too!!

Mind you we have the lovely and talented Niels - we should get by soon too.

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 19 Jul 08 - 06:43 AM

Oh what larks....
Just reading the title of this thread made me chuckle!

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: GUEST,pete Sumner
Date: 19 Jul 08 - 11:27 AM

Oh Ralphie, how could you....?

I have noted the several comments, not in this post, that 'have a go' in a not too subtle way...
Suppose it's true that those with low horizons have a problem seeing over the fence....
For me. Mike and the crew do a great job of providing a broad range of what is out there, in a genre that is hard to define and where popularity it taken as selling out...
How do you feel Ralphie ?...just curious...

Glad to have to prog back...
Thanks to all for confirming that it wasn't the International league of Folk Police....you never know with the bunch of jokers we have running the place.

Pete Sumner
California

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Sarah the flute
Date: 19 Jul 08 - 11:34 AM

The bit I caught on last week's show that made me laugh was MH and Jim M talking about the lack of airtime given to English folk music and MH in particular saying how disgraceful it was that it was always put along side other stuff (or words to that effect) ....ummmm???????

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Mr Red
Date: 19 Jul 08 - 01:41 PM

Pete Sumner
Some folks have a robust way of expressing themselves.
I don't like the delivery either - I just ignore it mostly. Much like the MH show. Personal tastes and all that. But I would not seek to denegrate it, it is all we have nationally. I list it on my website.

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: GUEST,Pete Sumner
Date: 19 Jul 08 - 02:08 PM

Mr Red
Thank you for the link...
What did I denigrate?
What is the 'all we have nationally'?
Who are the 'we'?

I just love the singing of Phil Tanner and Joseph Taylor but not for an hour of radio play...

The selection of progs on your site shows a huge range of music and tastes...Oh joy....

Mike doesn't need me to defend him, I'm sure he just "ignores it mostly" as you do....but the selections are broad and do offer those new to the music a chance to hear what is available...production values and quality being an important consideration.
Those who know their way around may choose alternate listening....that's great.
Perhaps you'd share with us all what you listen to....you, no doubt, will be introducing us to a world we don't know.

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Jim Moray
Date: 19 Jul 08 - 02:31 PM

>"The bit I caught on last week's show that made me laugh was MH and Jim M talking about the lack of airtime given to English folk music and MH in particular saying how disgraceful it was that it was always put along side other stuff (or words to that effect) ....ummmm???????"

Hi Sarah,
I'm not sure how you've formed that impression as it's certainly not my opinion. I would say that the aura of separation that people create around traditional music is the problem, rather than something to be encouraged.

It's always a battle to get airtime for english folk music, but it's always a battle to get airtime for ANY music - there is simply not enough space or enough hours in the day to broadcast, let alone listen, to all of it. I do however think that traditional music gets a fairly good crack of the whip (relatively...) at the moment and I hope the trend continues. As a listener I wouldn't want to see a specific BBC folk music station purely because I think traditional music should stand amongst other forms of music and compete on an equal footing - no more important, no less.

Jim

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 20 Jul 08 - 12:42 AM

Hi Mr Sumner.
Only my little joke, after having seen years of Harding bashing going on in various places.
I'm not one of them.
As a maintream show on Radio 2 Mike H has to appeal to a much wider cross section of the British public, so, obviously he will latch on to the names that might have popped into the national consciousness, Jim and Kate to name but two.
Having worked at the BBC for over 30 years, I know just how monolithic it can be, but, scratch the surface, and you will find many many here people championing "Folk" (God, I hate that word!) music.
For instance the late John Peel had sessions from the late 60's onwards.
in no particular order, Martin Carthy, Altan, Bothy Band, Cheviot Ranters, Chieftains, Shirley Collins, Boys of the Lough, Albion band, And so on....and on....and on

The Programme I was most involved with, before I retired, was Andy Kershaw. I've recently been going through the sessions and there are literally dozens of them. All of which were slotted in between his usual fare of The Clash etc.

Same with Late Junction, and their Womad coverage, and Radio 3 are even doing a Folk Prom tonight! (For a laugh, go read the Radio 3 message board, it's a hoot!!!)

Just a thought, I might just suggest to Mikes production team, to put a pointer on their website to other sources of "our" music on the web, you know Local Radio, Britfolk, etc, etc, in case the casual browser, wants to find out more.

I'm not sure if the Beeb would allow this, they do seem terrified of being accused of advertising, and indeed anything web based, but it's worth a go, methinks.
Anyway, I've rambled on far too much.

Just some thoughts

Ralphie

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: GUEST,twonk
Date: 20 Jul 08 - 12:50 AM

Hi Ralphie,
I'm [whatever name i might be using here from one day to the next]
always respect your informative BBC insider insights..

As I'm an avid purchaser of BBC sesion CDs [legal ones mostly]
I just wonder if theres ever the possibility
of an official BBC live sessions Lossless Flac download site..

maybe for a fair subscription price ?

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 20 Jul 08 - 01:55 AM

I'm not bashing Mike Harding but I'm curious to know why Mike is made to play such a wide range of music, this certainly doesn't apply to jazz programmes, classical programmes, blues, R&B or C&W so why Mikes show ?

eric

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 20 Jul 08 - 02:26 AM

Firstly Mr Red!
No I realise that this isn't about bashing anyone, I thinks that it's a problem of perception. Although MH's prog contains a lot of stuff that would appeal to us weirdos!, It's not billed as a folk programme. Yes, you have Jazz record requests, Bob Harris' Country, et al, which do what they say on the tin. This one is just called the Mike Harding show.
So, he can play just about anything he likes by and large. I do know that he spends a lot of time in Ireland, and is a real fan of the Irish culture.
But, within the constraints of his brief, I don't think he does a bad job, and, like it or not, Smooth Ops do provide, the Young Musician award, and the Folk Awards, (which occasionally gets TV coverage Blimey!)

Obviously we would all like more, but, we are sometimes well served by the aforementioned BBC4 documentary strand.

It's all a damn sight better than the 60's.

I think that whenever any network does something decent (Ch 5's recent series, for example) we should lavish praise on them.
In my experience, programme makers welcome all feedback to their work. They are not that thick skinned by and large.

It's always easier to moan about something, than it is to praise. Human nature I suppose.

As for Mr Twonk.

BBC sessions....Mmmm

As you are well aware, there was a company called Strange Fruit, that did a deal with the Beeb to release Peel sessions.
Nowadays, apart from the copyright problems that crop up now and again, musicians do have an option to purchase sessions from BBC Worldwide. And therefore release them.

The bad news is that a lot of stuff recorded in the 70's was thrown away.

The good news is that all Peel/Kershaw/Concerts/and anything else from all fields of music, that still exist, are now safely (?!) stored in a rather large database...

I very much doubt if they would be released willy nilly on the web, as I say, there are all sort of contractual hassles that would need to be worked out.

If anyone would like to get more of an insight, I would thouroughly reccommend The Peel Sessions book, by Ken Garner. Not only does it list in great detail every session ever recorded! but, tells the story of how the BBC works as regards live music.
(Oh and it's got my name in it too Hurrah!)
Hope this helps

Ralphie

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 20 Jul 08 - 05:10 AM

In that notorious interview which he gave to Living Tradition as long ago as 2001 (Issue 42), Mike Harding threw his weight behind the broadened, BBC-imposed remit for his Radio 2 show. It is absolutely not an outlet for trad music but a part of mainstream broadcasting produced not by the BBC as public service broadcaster but by a decidedly lightweight, independent company.

People don't always understand the concept of "follow through", MH said in justification. This is BBC-speak for fooling/persuading listeners to one programme carrying on to the next without noticing. The trick, he said, was to tempt the audience to stay with you and trying to avoid sharp edges whereby listeners might decide that the next programme was "not for them". This is achieved, apparently, by shoving kRusby & Lakeperson singles into the playlists. Hmmmm . . .

Some might term this dumbing down but the fact remains that if he refused to go along with this, he wouldn't have a job. As it is, Smooth Operations have continued to hang on to the contract to produce the BBC's only "f*lk-tinged" hour for the past decade, and draw in (if the listening figures are to be believed) an audience of a million +.

This, presumably, is what the the R3 listening stalwarts, up in arms at the abandonment of "proper" music for one day only at the Proms, think "f*lk music" is. The liberal scattering of what we (well some of us) would describe as real, living, breathing trad music of today throughout the R3 & 4 schedules in all sorts of guises escapes their attention or falls beneath their radar.

Personally, I'm wholly opposed to "don't rock the boat and be thankful for what we get" warnings. I thought the recent C5 series a load of sub-standard tripe (apart from Mr Lakeman's wry confession that he was guilty of violin abuse) and couldn't manage to praise it much. If I were Mark Thompson I'd be scheduling Bellowhead's Prom performance at primetime across all BBC networks. But I'm not. As they say on Tyneside, shy bairns get nowt.

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 20 Jul 08 - 06:43 AM

Mike Harding also used that Living Tradition interview for a personal attack on me.

He justified what he played solely by his increase in audience figures, I suppose this is all the BBC cares about.

eric

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: Sarah the flute
Date: 20 Jul 08 - 08:14 AM

Jim I wasn't digging at you merely expressing a comment on MH's remarks in the light of his usual playlists. ... sorry if I was too obscure!

As for the BBC folk proms concert why does coverage on TV cease at 9.15pm when the concert is scheduled to end until 9.30 at the earliest????? Will the cameras keep rolling for the full show at a later date?

Sarah

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: GUEST,Pete Sumner
Date: 20 Jul 08 - 10:22 AM

Ah, I feel SO much better now.....
Thanks for the clarification Ralphie...think your comments are right on.

As one who broadened my palate listening and bootlegging cassettes of 'Folk on Friday' many moons ago...so as to get a repertoire, I appreciate all that the broadcast media does in the name of that broad church of 'folk'....it could always do more...
That doesn't stop me from believing that there are some mean spirited souls out there who are just plain irritable and need to get a life...go climb a mountain.....good for your soul.

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: nager
Date: 20 Jul 08 - 05:40 PM

At least us folks out here in Australia can listen to the shows again now - which, I think, this thread was all about.
Thanks Beeb.

Subject: RE: Mike Harding Show - I've lost it
From: nager
Date: 21 Jul 08 - 07:57 PM

This is the reply I received from the Beeb this morning regarding changes to folk music broadcasting on the radio.


Dear Paul: Thanks for contacting the BBC regarding 'Folk and Acoustic with Mike Harding' and 'Celtic Heartbeat'.
Please note, the 'Folk and Country' website has been split into two separate websites for each genre, you can access these below: http://www.bbc.co.uk/music/genres/folk/ http://www.bbc.co.uk/music/genres/country/
Furthermore, you can access both programmes via the BBC radio iPlayer below: http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio2/shows/harding/index.shtml http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/radiowales/sites/celticheartbeat/