Origins: Pub With No Beer

Subject: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: GUEST
Date: 31 May 09 - 12:25 AM

Yes, I've seen the privious threads. My question is about the origins of the tune & words. I find Slim Dusty's name for both, then I find both are also claimed as trad & then some say the tune belongs to Stephen Foster's Beatuiful Dreamer. Anyone got the real story on this

Barry, on another's computer

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Joybell
Date: 31 May 09 - 01:35 AM

Hello Barry,
The tune is "Beautiful Dreamer" and anyone who listens to both songs can easily hear that it is. The first time I heard "Pub With No Beer" -- when it was first played on the radio -- I noticed. I must have been among the first to notice.
The words are a poem by a cane-cutter in Queensland, I believe, but I don't know the reference off the top of my head. Someone's sure to beat me to it.
Cheers, Joy

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: GUEST,Peace
Date: 31 May 09 - 02:22 AM

Wikipedia article that looks scholarly. AND informative.

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Joe Offer
Date: 31 May 09 - 02:45 AM

This 2003 obituary article says that in 1958 Slim Dusty recorded the sequels, "The Answer to a Pub With No Beer" and "The Sequel to a Pub With No Beer". In 1959 he recorded "The Pub Rock", but this was too much of a good thing.
Anybody had the lyrics to any of the sequels?

-Joe-

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Louie Roy
Date: 31 May 09 - 12:24 PM

I don't know what year it was but Benny Barnes came out with a tune called A Bar with no beer and the tune and the words are the same as The Pub With No Beer

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Barry Finn
Date: 31 May 09 - 05:43 PM

Well that was short & sweet. The story's not to long & not to old.
Thanks all for the leads, help & info, now to relearn the words. I wasn't gonna bother if I couldn't get the complete lowdown.
It's been probably 25 yrs since I sang this last

Barry

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Rowan
Date: 31 May 09 - 06:31 PM

I haven't time to chase up whether the following appeared in previous threads; I suspect it must have but didn't appear in my (cursory) examination of the wikipedia article. The original poem, as I recall, had stanzas of six lines rather than the four used in the song, and was published in the North Queensland Register during January 1944.

Cheers, Rowan

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 31 May 09 - 06:43 PM

Here's a page with a few more details. Evidently passing American troops in 1944 had drank the pub dry when a farmer called Dan Sheahan called in and was told they'd run out of beer. "He was quite a prolific Irish poet and he sat in the corner with a warm glass of wine and penned the poem 'A pub without beer'."

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: GEST
Date: 31 May 09 - 08:20 PM

I think we have most of the answers on this page from GEST Songs of Newfoundland and Labrador:
Pub With No Beer

GEST

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Sandy Mc Lean
Date: 31 May 09 - 10:23 PM

I sing this one quite often. Great song!

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: cobber
Date: 01 Jun 09 - 01:15 AM

Slim talked about this in his autobiography as there was always a discussion over how much of the song was the original by Dan Sheahan and how much was written by Gordon Parsons who "assembled" and copyrighted the version that Slim sang. If I remember rightly, he said that Gordon learned a fragment from someone, which would have been of the Dan Sheahan song, and wrote his song around it. Slim ended up good mates with Dan Sheahan and went on to record a few of his songs apparently which would have kept old Dan in beer money for quite a while. Back in the eighties and nineties, a song on a Slim Dusty record was reputed to be worth about ten grand in royalties.There was quite a famous court case over the tune which as mentioned before turned out to be close enough to Beautiful Dreamer for the owners of the Stephen Foster copyrights to win the case.

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: GUEST,mayomick
Date: 01 Jun 09 - 10:03 AM

Surprised to see that there is still a copyright on Beautiful Dreamer . Don't copyrights expire after a certain amount of years ?

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: open mike
Date: 01 Jun 09 - 04:14 PM

i do not think i have ever heard this song
but every time i see the thread title i
think of the song (was it by "America"?)
I rode thru the desert on a horse with no name...

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Jun 09 - 06:31 PM

Stephen Foster died back in 1864, and Beautiful Dreamer was published shortly afterwards. How the hell could there still have been be a copyright on the tune by the time Slim Dusty recorded Pub with No Beer in 1958?

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: GUEST,Mel.
Date: 07 Oct 09 - 06:02 PM

My Husband remembers the tune as a young boy in Germany (He is now over 70). I have heard it sung in german. But I do not know how old it may be. I hope to try and find out more.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: The Sandman
Date: 05 Aug 14 - 02:18 AM

pub with no beer was written by an irish man and adapted by slim dusty, and is available on the net

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Aug 14 - 05:31 AM

A ballad sheet (broadside) which was being sold around the fairs and markets in rural Ireland in the 1950s
The original was written by Dan Sheahan of Ingham, North Queensland (originally from Newmarket, Ireland).
Jim Carroll

THE BAR WITH NO STOUT
Now we've heard quite a lot of the Pub with no Beer,
And some people claim it's the hit of the year,
But during the war I was rambling about.
And I called for a Pint in a Bar with no Stout.

The bar owner sat on a chair by the fire,
I'd swear if you touched him he'd scrape like a brier,
When I aaid "Fill a Pint" then his rag he got out,
Saying "Your order is tall in the Bar with no Stout".

A customer came in a donkey and car,
He tied up his ass and took in a big jar,
But the ass jumped and reared, from the door he pulled out,
It's no place for an ass near a Bar with no Stout

The Garda on duty the first time in years,
Came back from his beat all shaken with fears,
The Sergeant said Pat, why you look knocked about,        
He stammered and told him the Bars got no Stout.

The Postman returned from his rounds on the street,
And when be had entered his time on the sheet,
The Postmaster seeing no froth round his mouth.
Guessed on the spot that the Bar had no Stout.

Now 'tis lonesome to part with the one you love dear,
Or to sit on a stool in a Pub with no Beer
But there's nothing more lonesome without any doubt,        
Than to call for a Pint in a Bar with no Stout.

Copyright by Cuthbertson, Printer. Listowel.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: MartinRyan
Date: 05 Aug 14 - 06:01 AM

Click here for one account of the history. Haven't tried to check the details.

Regards

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: GUEST,#
Date: 05 Aug 14 - 06:10 AM

Click here

The Wiki article at that link has a good general history of the song.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: The Sandman
Date: 05 Aug 14 - 06:28 AM

The original poem of Dan Sheahan
A PUB WITHOUT BEER
It is lonely away from your kindred and all
In the bushland at night when the warrigals call,
It is sad by the sea where the wild breakers boom,
Or to look on a grave and contemplate doom,
But there's nothing on earth half as lonely and drear
As to stand in the bar of a pub without beer

Madam with her needles sits still by the door,
The boss smokes in silence, he is joking no more,
There's a faraway look on the face of the bum,
While the barmaid looks down at the paint on her thumb,
The cook has gone cranky and the yardman is queer,
Oh, a terrible place is a pub without beer.

Once it stood by the wayside all stately and proud,
'Twas a home to the loafer a joy to the crowd,
Now all silent the rooftree that often times rang
When the navvys were paid and the cane cutters sang,
Some are sleeping their last in a land far from here.
Oh, a terrible place is a pub without beer.

They can hang to their coupons for sugar and tea,
And the shortage of sandshoes does not worry me,
And though benzine and razors be both frozen stiff,
What is wrong with the horse and the old fashioned ziff,
'Mid the worries of war there's but one thing I fear,
'Tis to stand in the bar of a pub without beer.

Oh, you brew of brown barley, what charm is shine,
'Neath thy spell men grow happy and cease to repine,
The cowards become brave and the weak become strong
The dour and the grumpy burst forth into song,
If there's aught to resemble high heaven down here,
'Tis the place of joy where they ladle out beer.

Ingham, 1944. Dan Sheehan

        
Slim Dusty's song "Pub with no beer"
It's lonesome away from your kindred and all
By the campfire at night where the wild dingos call
But there's nothin' so lonesome, so dull or so drear
Than to stand in the bar of a pub with no beer

Now the publican's anxious tor the quota to come
There's a faraway look on the face of the bum
A The maid's gone all cranky and the cook's acting queer
What a terrible place is a pub with no beer

The stockman rides up with his dry, dusty throat
He breasts up to the bar, pulls a wad from his coat
But the smile on his face quickly turns to a sneer
When the barman says suddenly: "The pub's got no beer!"

There's a dog on the verandah, for his masters waits
But the boss is inside drinking wine with his mates
He hurries for cover and he cringes in tear
It's no place tor a dog round a pub with no beer

Then in comes the swagman all covered with flies
He throws down his roll, wipes the sweat from his eyes
But when he is told he say, "What's this I hear?
I've trudged fifty flamin' miles to a pub with no beer?"

Old Billy, the blacksmith, the first time in his life
Has gone home cold sober to his darling wife
He walks in the kitchen: she says: "You're early, me dear" Then he breakes down and tells her that the pub's got no beer

It's lonesome away from your kindred and all
By the campfire at night where the wild dingos call
But there's nothin' so lonesome, so dull or so drear
Then to stand in the bar of a pub with no beer

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: Andrez
Date: 05 Aug 14 - 07:18 AM

Well bugger me! I always thought (in my ignorance) it was a Slim 'original' . So there you have it, the folk process in action :-)   

Makes the Men At Work copyright case 'borrowing a few notes from 'Kookaburra..' look kinda trivial in comparison to this

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Aug 14 - 08:00 AM

"Well bugger me! I always thought (in my ignorance) it was a Slim 'original' . So there you have it, the folk process in action"
I think you'll find that 'Bar With no Stout' was a parody on the original.
Slim Dusty's came out around 1957, the ballad sheet version is undated, but it looks as if it came out not long after.
It was claimed to be among the very last of the ballad sheets to appear at the fairs and markets in rural Ireland - it was a trade carried out almost exclusively by Travellers.
Sorry to have given the wrong impression
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: Louie Roy
Date: 05 Aug 14 - 10:06 AM

I have both of these song A bar with no beer and a pub with no beer and I can MP3 them to anyone that sends me their email   Louie Roy

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Aug 14 - 11:18 AM

"A bar with no beer and a pub with no beer and I can MP3 them to anyone that sends me their email"
Thanks Louie
I don't need either, but I would be interested to know where you learned 'Bar With No Beer'.
I have a scanned copy of the ballad sheet which I thought to be the only surviving example of it - would love to know if there were more
Thanks for the offer
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Aug 14 - 12:24 PM

What is not mentioned in the links above is that Gordon Parsons, who wrote the song based on Sheahan's poem, and Slim Dusty did not see the song as hit potential.It was first sung by Parsons who was touring with Slim Dusty as part of the Slim Dusty Show in the Theatre Royal in Townsville in 1956. Slim asked could he use it as a flip-side for his next single and Parsons agreed. Before the single was released, they embarked on a major tour of Australia lasting almost 2 years, and every venue they played they were amazed to hear requests for "Pub with No Beer", but nobody was talking. Months later, Slim Dusty got an L/P in the post, with just a note to say "I thought you might like this". The concert had been recorded and pressed to L/Ps by some guys who went 2 or 3 days ahead of the scheduled tour selling the bootleg L/Ps.
Slim Dusty's record company later asked him had he got a good copy, as they wanted to release it as a collectors item. "No problem,", said Slim," but I don't see the point, every fecker in Australia has the bootleg ". You can get a copy on CD "The Slim Dusty Show" EMI 8324072.
There were no copyright problems with Sheahan. Slim Dusty finally tracked him down and Sheahan said since he wrote it as a poem, and it's being lying in Newspaper Archives foe 12 years, he would not be making any claim on it. Slim insisted on giving some reward to Sheahan, and asked had he any more poems that might make a song. Slim set music to some of his poems, including "When You're Short of a Smoke", which is just as sad and dreary as "Pub With No Beer".

First verse:
"The weather was wet, it had rained all the week,
My camp and tobacco went down with the creek
They floated away--'mongst the Ti Tree and Oak
They left me lamenting, and short of a smoke"

Can't write anymore, I'm getting emotional!
You might find a copy of "Songs from the Canefields" by Dan Sheahan in a library or on the net. Well worth a look.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: Andrez
Date: 06 Aug 14 - 07:23 AM

OK thanks Guest, thats a little more social history I never knew. That aside, on reflection oim 'tinkin 'ere that there isnt much point to a bar or a pub with no beer is there?

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: zozimus
Date: 06 Aug 14 - 02:04 PM

Hi Andrez,
Another bit of social history. The poem by Sheahan was based on a real event. In the Summer of 1943, he rode on his horse from his farm in Ingham to his local, the Day Dawn Hotel in Lannercost Street for a couple of pints, only to find that the beer(Cairns Draft Beer) had been sold out.Later he discovered a few thousand American servicemen had been billeted in the area,following some Pacific Ocean engagements, and soon drank the pub dry.
The real Australian heroes in those days would be the men who delivered beer to pubs in remote areas, come hail, rain or snow. Slim Dusty has another song about their dedication. It's about two guys whose truck got stuck in the mud after a downpour. They decide they only way to free the truck is to lighten the load, so they tear into the drink! I think the song is called "To Lighten the Load",

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Aug 14 - 02:10 PM

All of this information is making me thirsty
Jim Carroll

Bluey Brink
There once was a shearer by name Bluey Brink
A devil for work and a terror for drink
He could shear a full hundred each day without fear
And drink without winking four gallons of beer

Now Jimmy the barman who served out the drink
He hated the sight of this here Bluey Brink
Who stayed much too late and who came much too soon
At morning, at evening, at night and at noon

One day as Jimmy was cleaning the bar
With sulphuric acid he kept in a jar
Along comes this shearer a bawling with thirst
Saying whatever you've got Jim just give me the first

Now it aint in the history, you wont find it in print
But that shearer drunk acid with never a wink
Saying that's the stuff Jimmy why strike me stone dead
This'll make me the ringer of Stephenson's shed

All through that long day as he served up the beer
Poor Jimmy was sick with his trouble and fear
Too anxious to argue too worried to fight
He saw that poor shearer a corpse in his fright

But early next morning when he opened the door
Well there was that shearer a yelling for more
With his eyebrows all singed and his whiskers deranged
And holes in hide hide like a dog with the mange.

Says Jimmy and how did you find the new stuff?
Says Bluey it's fine but I've not had enough
It gives me great courage to shear and to fight
But why does that stuff set me whiskers alight?

I thought I knew grog, but I must have been wrong
The stuff that you gave me was proper and strong
It set me to coughing and you know I'm no liar
But every damn cough set me whiskers on fire
Notes

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: Andrez
Date: 07 Aug 14 - 05:20 AM

Hi there zozimus thanks to you too for fleshing out my knowledge of the PWNB yarn even more. Much appreciated. As they say in the classics: me cup runneth over!

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: Lyr Add: The Answer to a Pub With No Beer
From: Mysha
Date: 07 Aug 14 - 06:15 AM

Hi,

Continued a year later with this:


Answer to The Pub With No Beer (Slim Dusty)

Where the hills roll away, from a small country town,
There are hearts filled with sorrow as the word spreads around,
And the jackass won't laugh, 'cos there's no jokes to hear,
So let me tell you the reason for the pub with no beer.

Broken down on the track, for she's stripped every gear
Stand the old grey blitz wagon, the one with the beer
And the driver's near mad, standin' scratchin' his ear,
He knows just what they're thinkin', at the pub with no beer.

When the drover rides out and draws reign by the truck
He joins in with the driver and curses their luck,
"Where's Billy the blacksmith, we could do with him here"
But Bill moved on to Grafton where the brewery stands near,

So the drover rides back, with a brilliant idea,
He rides hard in the saddle 'til the town's drawin' near,
He dismounts in the lane and the dog cringes near,
As the swaggie's just leavin' the pub with no beer.

There's exitement all 'round as the drover tells where,
The old blitz is busted on the plains way out there,
"Every man that can ride." says the drover to all,
"Saddle up, lets get movin', and we'll bring back the haul."

When the boys rode back in, what a strange sight they made,
They charged into the town like the old light brigade,
With tow ropes and tackle, they all pulled as one
And the old blitz moved faster than she ever had done.

Soon the kegs were rolled in, one was placed on the bar,
They filled all the glasses, every jug, and each jar
Soon the word passed around, and they all gave a cheer,
And there was laughter once more in the pub with no beer.


(There's even another sequel, apparently, titled very descriptively as "The Sequel To A Pub With No Beer". I don't think I ever heard that one, though.)

Bye
                                                               Mysha

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: Louie Roy
Date: 07 Aug 14 - 04:01 PM

I have two different recording of a bar with no beer and a pub with no beer and neither one of them have the words that have been posted they are completely different Louie Roy

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Pub With No Beer
From: Andrez
Date: 07 Aug 14 - 09:19 PM

Hi Louie R, do you have details re who sang them and when/where these were recorded? Would you be able to transcribe the lyrics to share at all?

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: GUEST,SqueezeMe
Date: 08 Aug 14 - 02:51 AM

Mysha, The "Sequal" is here.

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Mysha
Date: 08 Aug 14 - 04:12 AM

Hi SqueezeMe,

Thanks for the link. Myspace doesn't work for me; it never has. My guess would be that they are to Microsoft-oriented, so I hope I'll remember to try next week from a computer at work. I might not be able to write out the lyrics that way, though, as I'm supposed to be doing, well, work. So feel free to post those if you have them or can make them out.

The tension of it all ... What's going to happen to the poor pub?

Bye
                                                                Mysha

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: GUEST,SqueezeMe
Date: 09 Aug 14 - 08:26 PM

Slim Dusty – Sequel To The Pub With No Beer

It won't happen again at the pub way out back
Since they air freight the beer and are done with the track
They've gone all real modern as you soon will hear
Now it's all ancient history, the pub with no beer

The drover we knew rests his horse now for keeps
And he rides 'round the town in the latest of jeeps
There's the old swaggy now, he's a different man too
With a joke he'll say don't step on my blue suede shoes

The pub has no verandah, it's a new smart drive in
Where they serve you with cocktails, liqueurs and gin
There's no dog in the lane and there's no hitching post
The boss is no barman he's known as "mine host"

Older Billy the blacksmith, shot home like a gun
And rebuilt the old place with money he'd won
Now he'll service your car with the greatest of care
Since there's no need for horses on the plains way out there

When it's all said and done there was no need to curse
Although things were bad they might have been worse
The locals so proud all make this their boast
More money rolls in than along the Gold Coast

So it's lonesome no more at the new Hotel Grande
Where there's laughter and song plus a rock and roll band
But the old timers smile through the laughter and cheer
'Cause they remember the days when the pub had no beer

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Mysha
Date: 10 Aug 14 - 05:43 AM

Hi,

So that's what happened to the poor pub. Thanks for adding the final lyrics of the trilogy.

This does make me wonder, though: Is the pub better off as the Hotel Grande? To me, more modern doesn't necessarily mean progress. I wonder whether Slim Dusty meant it to be, and sings it so.

Bye
                                                                  Mysha

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: GUEST,SqueezeMe
Date: 10 Aug 14 - 09:48 AM

It seems just a fairly neutral comment on "progress"; from the written word, the reader must make up his or her own mind whether progress is a step forward or two steps back...

In another Aussie song, Across the Western Suburbs, written by Seamus Gill and Denis Kevans, there is this verse:

What's happened to the pub, our little local pub
Where we used to have a drink when we were dry, boys
Now we can't get in the door for there's carpet on the floor
And you won't be served a beer without a tie, boys.

Fairly innocuous in reading from the page, but most live renditions I've heard contain a fair bit of venom.

Regretably, I've never heard Slim perform "Sequal" live, so hard to guage Slim's real opinion on the matter.

Delivery is everything (and I don't just mean the beer!)

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: GUEST,SqueezeMe
Date: 10 Aug 14 - 09:58 AM

Some years back, I heard a parody on PWNB sung at the National Folk Festival (I think), lamenting the lack of stock in the vending machine in the Gent's toilet.
Not sure who sang it, though Martin Pearson comes to mind.
Anyone got the words???

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Andrez
Date: 11 Aug 14 - 05:24 AM

Ha ha that would have been funny. Martin Pearson would have done it well. It would be great to see those lyrics too.

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Mysha
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 06:22 PM

Hi SqueezeMe,

It might be better to start a new thread to ask for those lyrics. That way you can have "Lyr Req" in the title to alert people that you're looking for lyrics, rather than the origin.
What else do you recall about it?

Bye
                                                                  Mysha

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Rumncoke
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 07:15 PM

I remember the weekend I was with John Lilbourn's regiment of musket and pike, refighting one of the battles of the English Civil war, and the pub in the village ran out of beer, despite being warned that they should get in a lot extra for the Saturday.

The atmosphere was terribly gloomy. Some one said 'I know a song about a pub with no beer' - but he didn't dare sing it.

Subject: RE: Origins: Pub With No Beer
From: Mysha
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 03:31 AM

Hi,

"I remember the weekend I was with John Lilbourn's regiment of musket and pike, refighting one of the battles of the English Civil war, and the pub in the village ran out of beer, despite being warned that they should get in a lot extra for the Saturday."

You know: You should write a song about that.

Bye
                                                                  Mysha